Transcript
Action Park Media said they thought they defeated you. A person who your hater, they thought they defeated you. The person who told you you'll never amount to anything. They thought they defeated you. They thought they defeated you. I need you to say I like it here. One two three four two three. Two three. Hey, welcome back. I'm Jonathan live and I'm Barbie blank. Now we're going to start off just by do a little update on our lives. How are you doing, Barbie? I'm doing good. I'm hanging in there, getting a lot of home workouts in trying to to drink my my wine at night to keep me sane. But it's been OK. How about you? Is your is your wine out now? It is. You will get it is. It's a rosé wine. It's called be tasteful. Awesome. I'm still waiting on my bottles of it. I promise. I'll see you next week. That's awesome. I just been, you know, staying motivated, working out, trying to do some of my own personal projects. Also, we have some comeback kids of the week. Who's your comeback kid of the week? Well, in general, I'm just, you know, my comeback kid is basically all the nurses, all the doctors, all the firefighters, everybody who is on the forefront of, you know, the quarantine and helping everybody out and just kind of risking their lives. And so just thank you. And I think they're my comeback kids. What about you specifically my my Muay Thai coach, but also just owners of small, private gyms who are finding a way to connect with their people via Zoom and do whatever they can, particularly my coach Julio Tran Jr.. He has been getting in the best shape of his life. He's super lean now. He's been motivating people to run, you know, multiple miles a day. People don't normally run right. He's really kept everybody united and kept it kind of like a family unit, you know, despite everything going on. Oh, I love that. That's great. Yeah, very cool. Yeah. So we have an amazing guest. We do. I'm very excited. I grew up watching this guy and everything, but no bowl parts and everything. Everything from Mallrats Blow. Remember the Titans? I love butterfly effect. That's like, Oh yeah, one of my favorite characters. And also, he has had an amazing journey, gaining and losing close to a thousand pounds and really has as transformed his life multiple times and has found a lot of growth through that. So without further ado. Ethan, simply, thanks for having me, guys. So much for coming on. Yeah, I'm really excited to do this. Or we're yeah, you know, I had a chance. Listen to your podcast. It's amazing. It's really inspirational. You were someone. I definitely when we decided to do podcasts, I had my eye on getting you on because you fit perfectly, you know, for what we're going for. Sure. I'm stoked. I'm a big fan of both of you guys, and I think it's great that you're doing this. Thank you so much. I do want to say that I feel like it was slightly hyperbolic when I said I've lost, gained and lost close to a thousand pounds. I don't know that that is accurate. Yeah, but it's a lot. The numbers are really big and it was the sound bite I was looking for. Yeah. When I was writing my question, yeah, first off, looking at your career, you've had an amazing career. Just acting aside, just you have been in so many memorable roles in memorable movies and your you started off acting at a young age. Your parents were actors. Yes, my parents were actors in New York in the late 60s, early 70s, and then I was born and they kind of quickly gave it up once I was born because they didn't feel that industry was necessarily amenable to, like raising a kid. There were touring, you know, New York in the 70s was more plays than movies, and so they would wind up on tour and not see each other for months at a time. And they kind of both quit because of me. Yeah, but they were. They both went to Carnegie Mellon School for Drama in Pittsburgh, and they were super theater nerd people. Growing up, was there a certain point growing up when you're like, I want to do this, or did they not want you to? Do they want you to stay in New York? No, no. We moved out here when I was very young. They neither wanted me to or didn't want me to. And the point that I kind of was like, Oh, we're in Hollywood, that's like a real job you can have. I notice that certain friends of mine at school when I was like 13, 14 years old would check out for three or four months to go and work. And when I'd ask them, like, what does that mean? And they'd explain what you do school for like two hours a day and then you're just like on a set with actors and there's like a snack table and there's all these goodies and like, you're really just playing make believe. I was like, Yeah, that's what I want to do, because it doesn't sound like a real job. Yeah. You know, it wasn't anything similar to what my parents described as acting. You know, theater was very long days and a lot of rehearsal, and this sounded way more like playtime. I feel like we all can relate to that. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, I mean, I think that we all have definitely a similar thing. We didn't one traditional career paths. Yeah. Did you? What was the like first job job? You had actual gig. The first job I had was Boy meets world. Wow. Yeah, I was 16, I think. And I went to do one episode of that and wound. Up doing like 30. That was my first job. And was that without any acting training or no, I did in school, I did a couple of plays and then I went to some acting classes, but I very quickly was not into the acting classes. And one of the last critiques I got in acting class was that was fine. Do that scene again so I can figure out what you did wrong. And I was like, What is this? I'm not. I mean, what I did wrong. It's all subjective. How could I have done anything wrong? I don't think you know what I mean? Yeah. And so I quit that and then just went and started working. And that was really where I learned. I think there is some value to be had in an acting class, but I think the majority of the stuff that I feel that I keep with me today is lessons I learned from work. Yeah, I mean, and also you what better training than working with incredible actors like you have your whole career? I agree. I mean, I take classes, but I had to find the right one. You know, somebody who should be able to open up your creativity, not shut it down. I think that's the problem with a lot of classes, just just in general. Education is shutting down creativity. Yeah. You know, and it should open open that up. Totally. But so you start acting at 16 and at this point, you said that you started with your when I was listening, your weight struggles at five. Yeah. So going into acting, which is a very vain industry, you know, you're you're you're working at 16. You're heavy. Did it weigh on you heavily at you? You know where? Yeah, struggling with that, you know, there were a couple of signs that in retrospect, I just don't know if I was immature, I didn't care. I wasn't paying attention to them. But I remember between season one, the first season of Boy Meets World that I did in the second season, my agents got a note from the producer saying, Hey, Ethan doesn't have to gain weight for this, which we think he might be doing. And I, I wasn't there was no like analytical process going like this character's bigger than I am. I should eat whatever I want. That wasn't occurring. I think if anything, I just had my own money. And so it was like had suddenly was had access to all this food that I don't know before that I'd have to get money from my parents or do some weird, odd jobs to get. And now at 16, you get paid pretty well per week and I could just do whatever I wanted and whatever I wanted involved eating a lot. So I there wasn't a moment where I at that age, certainly where I had thoughts of like, I should go on a diet and just didn't occur to me as roles went on and you were doing more and more stuff where these roles were, you had to gain more weight for roles where they like, OK, we want you to put on more weight for this one or we want you to. Were you asked to do that? Never. I think I was so big the first time I overtly wanted to stay away from anything that had like fat shaming in the dialogue, right? Or, you know, if there was some thing that came up like there was a movie called, I Think a briefing. Kevin Connolly is in this movie, a brief moment in the life of Angus Bethune when it's just Angus. And I started out with a longer title, right? Very long time. Yeah. So that was the first time where I went to do something where weight was a central theme, right? But it was done, really. It was used really well, and it was, I think, between me and Charlie. And then ultimately, Charlie Talbot got the role of Angus, and then there was another role of a fatter kid in it that they gave to me and they hired me. And then that role got cut up. But that was the first time that I ever, thought or ever had. Up until then, Boy Meets World wasn't written for a fat guy, and Mallrats wasn't written for a fat guy. And I guess below was written for a fat guy. But this was this kind of precedes blow and butterfly effect. There were definitely parts written for an overweight guy, but it wasn't like the the brunt of jokes. It wasn't there wasn't fat shaming, and when I would get sent something by my agents where it was like, We need a fat guy because we need to make this fat guy joke, I wasn't interested in that. Yeah, but the first time I ever had a consideration on my weight either way was Remember the Titans and I got hired to do that movie. There was a training camp a month away. Yeah, and I started exercising because I was like, I got to get in shape for this training camp. I maybe lost 20 pounds and was training camp was a disaster, but that was the first time I ever thought that and that was written for a big guy too. Probably not as big as I was, but it was written for a guy who was running or like I was at a safety era. I don't know anything. This is one of the bigger events, but yeah, after you did that movie. At what point were you like, OK, I'm just in an unhealthy weight or I just want to start losing weight, or I never really. I mean, I had some substance abuse problems, and there were definitely times where I would be going to bed thinking I could die tonight, like this might be it. And kind of. So I just didn't really care. And then I got sober and I met a girl. I met a girl that I really cared about who had no did not give a crap. I have a real potty mouth, so I'm going to go, No, really. She did not give a crap about actors or wasn't impressed by Hollywood at all and genuinely cared about me and wasn't interested in nightclubs. And going to movie premieres was just an awesome girl, and I really, really cared about her. And when I would start to think about the future with her, I realized very quickly that the future that she wanted, I wouldn't necessarily be able to give her at my weight that I needed to change something. And that was what kind of spun me off in that direction and how far into sobriety was that, would you say? I mean, you know, sobriety was tenuous at that time, so it was not. It was not long and it was very fragile at the time. You know, that was a long time ago now. But but it was it was very early. It was kind of like, you know, I think with anything, if you try to tackle every issue you have at once, you might not be the best way to go about it. And so had I gone like, I need to get sober and lose weight and like, become a nicer person and deal with anger and like all of that at once might have failed. So I definitely did sobriety first, which which was I was on a path that was going to kill me quicker. Doing that, you know, obesity can take decades to kill you, right? And I had decades of obesity at that point, but clearly I did it in the right sequence and that was around 2000 to 2000. Yeah, 2002. Remember the Titans? Yeah, you did what? Yeah, we remember the Titans. I think Barlow was after Remember the Titans? John Q. with Kevin Conroy second movie together, Cold Mountain and the first twenty million is always the hardest. The butterfly effect. Right? Okay, so so you're sober before cold mountain and then Cold Mountain, you fell off a little bit a cold mountain. Yeah, Cold Mountain was rocky. There was like, that was kind of the beginning, and that was where I really got my s**t together. Yeah, yeah. You had an experience with Jim Caviezel. Yeah, that kind of shaped a lot of this and that was on the flight to Cold Mountain. Yeah, there were a bunch of flights. The movie took like nine months to shoot, and I went back and forth a lot and I would go over there and spend a month and then come back. There was one point where I landed in L.A. and had a message on my phone saying, Don't leave the airport, you have to come right back to Romania, which really sucked. But I went back and forth a lot, and one of the trips I ran into Jim in the the Lufthansa First Class lounge, and we were going to do a version of Robin Hood. For some reason, I'm imagining that it was a version of Robin Hood that took place during the Revolutionary War in Vermont that kind of conflated the story of Robin Hood with the story of Ethan Allen battling Fort Ticonderoga. I could be totally making that. Yeah, maybe it was just a straight up Robin Hood thing. Yeah, we were going to do this. We were both attached to it. And then the movie fell apart, so we knew who each other were, but we had never met. And so when we saw each other in the lounge, we said hello. And then he happened to be on the flight with me to Frankfurt, where at that point I was going to Romania and he was going somewhere else in Europe, and he came the seat next to me was open on the flight. He came and sat down. And, you know, look, I am kind of a moral relativist and think that whatever is true for me cannot necessarily be true for anyone else. And so I wouldn't try to mold your reality to comport with mine. But he clearly has other ideas about morality, and he, I feel, was doing what he thought was right. Like, I don't fault him for that. I think his integrity was sound, and I don't think he's a bad guy, but he had a very uncomfortable conversation with me now. I hadn't had that like nobody else had had. Kevin Connolly had tried to have that conversation with me a couple of times. And I think we were just too close and he failed because I just told him to go, f**k. So, you know, those were years ago. Yeah. And you're hung up on me, right? I mean, so there's just Jim Caviezel. I don't know him at all. I have respect for him. He's a great actor, he's a peer, and he's basically laying out this pitch for like, you need to emulate Jesus Christ. Now I'm not crapping on Jesus Christ. Jesus Christ was a bad a*s dude. Not necessarily the dude that I think about all the time in my day to day, but like historically, I think he's awesome. I think he represents something super positive to a lot of people, so I have total respect for him. But the end of it was just kind of me feeling crappy about myself and thinking, like Jim Caviezel, Caviezel thinks I'm going to hell because of my life, and I just wanted to not be in a position where anybody felt like they could have that conversation with me again. So, you know, it worked his, you know, I'm super thankful that he did that because that was kind of the nail that just triggered the weight loss that triggered the sobriety. Yeah. Like, I made the decision at that point that I'm going to change my life and I'm going to lose weight. And it was kind of something I had been thinking about because of this girl. And then I had this conversation with Jim and it was like, I have to change now because God forbid, somebody had a conversation like that with me in front of her. Yeah. There was a weird thing that was happening to. Did she not know the severity of what of what you were going through? That is the weird thing. Like being 500 pounds is an objective thing. It's not like a mental disorder that I can hide. That is just a fact. I don't fit in a regular plane seat. I need an extension to get on a first class seat like there's a lot I have to sit down because I can't walk a mile. I mean, you know, we as actors know we spend a lot of time on our feet. My feet would I would have to lay down and think every night after a day of work. I wonder if I'll be able to walk tomorrow. Like, that's how bad my feet hurt, like. So those are these issues. She didn't know any of that, but it was weird because we had never talked about it. So I really had this feeling that if I say something to her, is it like something that's hidden? Somehow I fooled her and she can't see this right? And if I communicate about it, do I rip the curtain back? And suddenly she sees me in a different light, which to me seemed like it would be repulsive. So it was very hard to to talk to her about it. But I also knew, like, I'm not going to do this on my own because I don't know what to do. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And so I called her and I had a very emotional conversation with her where I said, like, I don't know what to do. I need you to tell me what to do. I'm going to do exactly what you tell me, and I'm going to change this. And I did. And kind of over the course of the first segment of weight loss, I eventually was able to start going like, OK, I can be responsible for myself now. I've got my legs under me now. Let me start looking into different avenues that will work best long term because this is not a one year thing that I then get to forget about. This is with me forever. Yes. And was that first major weight loss that was post my name is Earl or Prima. My name is Earl. Yeah. So when you had the first major weight loss, you were talking about how it affected your career? Yeah. Were reps telling you to put back on weight? Were they being that bold as to be like, No, you have to be this big guy? Yeah, yeah, it happened. Kind of. Bizarrely, so I did. Cold Mountain started losing weight. The butterfly effect and the butterfly effect was maybe before Cold Mountain, but did a couple of other movies, did a movie called Without a paddle and had continued losing weight, and I went from about 540 down to around 300. Wow. And nobody was bummed out with me at all. It was totally fine. And then did. My name is Earl, and that was great because it was like, I can cruise now. You know, here's a job that can last for however long. And I'm, you know, and then it was like a weird thing of like turning down movies during the summer because it's I've got a few months off. We've been working insane hours, which was so stupid in retrospect. Like, I wish I did a bunch of those, you know? But like, I had a steady nine to five job, basically hard nine to nine or nine to 11 job, whatever the crazy hours were on and nobody was upset when I started doing. My name is Earl. I was around 300 pounds and I remember thinking, this is a good weight for. This character, so I'm not going to like, try to lose weight. And what happened was I wound up gaining 100 pounds over five years of doing that show. So I kind of get comfortable. Yeah, I took my foot off the gas and I gained 100 pounds. Right? Yeah. Now then, after my name is Earl, I got super serious and lost from around 400 to around 200 pounds. And that's where I noticed, like people didn't know what to do with me. At 200 pounds, I was like, properly thin. That's insane, because it's not like you lost your talent with the way I write it. That's the weirdest thing. Yeah, it's like it's that's just so odd, you know? Yeah, it's like, you know, because you're talking about us, listen to your podcast. Well, we don't know where you fit because what we liked. Yeah, you're no longer that. Yeah, yeah, it was very weird. I was also uncomfortable at 200 pounds like I. I'm 260 right now and I feel pretty comfortable. You're very you're tall. Yeah. Oh God. I mean, you know what I mean? I like being a big guy at 200. I didn't know who I was either, necessarily. Now I don't know that I was a worst actor at two. I don't know if that mentally, I don't know what it was, but I definitely work slowed down. I did a bunch of pilots, but like, that's always like playing the lottery, you know? But like, the movies dried up in a big way. Did it f**k with your sobriety at all when work slowed? No, because at that point I had kids and I was like a full family guy, and no doubt that didn't become an issue. So would you say that was the largest kind of hurdle for you? Career wise was going through that period where you lost a lot and they didn't know what to do with you? Yeah, it was weird. I thought, like, maybe I'm done acting, you know, I didn't know it was. It was a it was a bizarre feeling. But then I also was like, I'm going to gain weight, and I gained weight and then started working again. So. And how much did you gain around on the way back up? I went from around 200. I think I did the wolf of Wall Street. I was like 265 and I was doing CrossFit and lifting weights and eating everything in sight. And then I was like, OK, maybe this is the way for me. I had more body fat at that point than I have now, but I was kind of like, more comfortable. Yeah. And then I just kept gaining weight and did a TV show called Chance, where that was written for a big guy. And I was like, I can eat whatever I want. And went up to like almost 400 again. And what year was was that chance? Yeah. Was 2016 and 17. OK? Wow, that's not that. Yeah, yeah. What do you think besides? I mean, obviously, sadly, gaining the way back helped the career. What do you think? Was there anything mentally you did to get over that slump? I think I was just more comfortable with myself. I'm really comfortable with myself now, and I'm so comfortable that I like think about if somebody came and said gained 50 pounds and you know, you're going to be working again. I would go like, I don't know, man, I'm pretty happy with this and I feel healthy. My blood's real clean. Like, I don't know that that's worth it unless you're going to show me something. By the way, I've been doing this almost 30 years. Well, what's it going to be like? Is it going to be some f**king masterpiece, like some new Shakespeare that's going to break the mold? Or is it going to be some movie that I feel like I've done a version of? Or am I going to play like the sweet, dumb guy which I've done 300 times? You know what I mean? Like, I don't know that it's worth it to me to just be like back in that fat guy category again. So I don't know. So the second time after you gained a lot of weight, you know, over the years of my name is Earl, what was the so Jim Caviezel was the first like month? Yeah. What was the second thing that propelled you to then lose it again? I had had skin reduction surgery and to like because you lose weight and especially if you're really big for a long period of time, your skin. Yeah. And then I gained weight on top of that and stretched my skin out again and had scars. And by the way, the skin reduction surgery is like a total nightmare. It's not like I kept thinking, this isn't going to be so bad. It's really awful. So I did that and then gained weight, and then my name is. Earl was done and we had a bunch of money in the bank and I was like, I want to. I want to lose weight again. And I just started like exercising like a maniac, riding a bike. And I and I fell in love with cycling and I would ride my bike eight hours a day, like six days a week. And I just it was just like, I'm going to get this handled. I don't want to do this f**kin beef fat anymore. You know, I can relate, especially to the being comfortable at a certain way. Yeah, and in a certain way, because I got really cut up for a thing I did and I didn't like the lifestyle at all. I was carrying this before the apps you can have on your phone. So I'm carrying around my laptop and a food scale, and I'm like getting really cut. And they told me, like because I had this shirtless movie, shirtless scene in a movie I'd worked in a while. I was like, f**k, I need to like, I didn't look good so I could go on the pay for me to get my chest waxed. And it's like the scene from The 40-Year-Old Virgin. I bleed through my shirt and I go and I show up the day and I'm just shredded and I'm like, You know, and it's so uncomfortable and I hate it. And then they're like, You know what, actually, we're going to put a shirt on you for the same after that, I don't know, four or five months of it. And I was like, I hate this, that I end up rebelling the other way. I did a photoshoot or whatever for. And it ended up kind of like going viral at the time, and I was like, f**k, I hate this, and I just ate so much after that and I got sore for a while, you know, and it was just I was rebelling against being something also that was not who I am as an actor. Yeah. And I think it's important for people to like we look and we see these shredded people. We see, you know, the Hemsworth's of the world, all the crises. And there's a difference between being super ripped and unhappy and like in really good shape and really happy. Yeah. And I think that's really important that you touch on that, you know, and you have been touching on that. And it's because people just look and they go, well, they must be so happy because they're so shredded. And I remember being in my apartment and, you know, six percent body fat and being like my friends, going and doing things and me being like, well, can't really do anything because, you know, yeah, I'm going to eat this piece of this and put it on my scale. And my friends have taken shots and I'm like, you know, suck it up and look. And then people tell me, Oh, you don't look great, you know, because because I have a naturally fuller face and it was like inward. And yeah, I mean, listen to the weird trade offs are real. Yeah, you know, and I imagine you as a girl have all a whole list of weird trade offs that we can't even relate to. Like, I want more muscle to fill in the excess skin that I have, and because I like being a big guy. I also want to have a six pack because, you know, and I've got a four pack right now, and I'm like, Well, that's not good enough. I want to start getting to a six pack is a f**king nightmare. Yeah. And like, there's no way I'm going to sustain. So like, I'm just shooting for that goal. I'm going to get to that goal, set a new goal. But like, yeah, all the sunken cheeks, the loose skin that comes along with getting rid of all your body fat, it's a f**king nightmare. I mean, for me, too, because I was, you know, I wrestled for WWE for a very long time at a very young age. And you're on every Monday night live television and you're in HD, so you better be in the best shape possible because you were going to get scrutinized. People are going to say, Oh my gosh, she's gained so much weight. I mean, so constantly. You were just like having to be like on point. You can't, you know, miss you can't have a cheat meal. You can't, you know, you can't just go out and party for a weekend and go back and be like, because you're going to see it right. So we were just always on a very strict schedule diet, working out every day, three hours a day. So, you know, coming from that background, you know, it was I get guess it was rough. Yeah. And one cheat meal you can see at that party sandwich, it's like, Oh, exactly. And you were, what, 19 19 genes? Yeah. So, you know, and I definitely dealt with my, you know, my issues with, you know, bullying and being bullied, especially with social media and people, you know, just having their own opinion about that and no one's ever really happy. You know, there's always something I I will say. I have a lot of people who are super supportive of me, and I found that I kind of moved from Twitter to Instagram, where like 90 percent of the stuff on Twitter I find to be super negative. That was the case where we were in the PR. Twitter was the peak of I mean, it's crazy. It's crazy. People are not nice. And then I jump over to Instagram and it's like, Oh my God, everybody. So, yeah, so support. But then there will still be occasionally somebody who's like, You're still fat. And I'm like, What does that mean? Yeah, I'm OK. Yeah, I'll always feel fat like I felt fat at 200 pounds and too small at the same time. Like, how the f**k does that work? Right, right? I am 13 percent body fat today. What do you want for me, dude? You know? Yeah, I mean, if you if you're too lean, then it's like, Well, where does your size go, right? Then it's like, then we're supposed not lean. Yeah, I was swimming in 28 30 pants. You know, I was like, everything was falling off me. I'm like. And it did create, I'm not going to lie still. And I like many of. US, I'd say the majority of people, it f**ked up my sense of body when I look in the mirror now, I guess a good question for kind of all of us in years is how have you maintained your sanity and a healthy sense of your body without letting body dysmorphia take over? I never trust my mind. I set goals that are as objective as possible that I sit back and I go like the numbers I don't think really matter. But the numbers are going to be kind of the the metric system that I use to like get to what I think will look cool, right? Right. That makes sense. Yeah. So I said, I'm going, I want to be below 10 percent body fat. Why? Because I never have, and because I'll have my six pack or close to my eight pack at that point. You know what I mean? Like, and I'm not going to stay there. That's just going to be like one day I'll take a photo shoot with my shirt off. I'll feel like I look like s**t and my skin is loose and I look like an old man and I'll be like, This sucks, and then I'll go on, set a new goal and do something else. But I just never trust myself. You know what I mean? Like, so I've got these things, these moments laid out in time that are kind of benchmarks that will trigger new goals because because like, what's my overall goal if I shot for my overall goal right now, I would miss these other kind of like ancillary goals. I'm looking at the smaller goals first and kind of ignoring because if I wake up and I didn't get a good night's sleep the night before, I could wake up and be like, This is all pointless. I look like s**t. I'm putting a bunch of effort into something that's ultimately pointless, but I know that if I don't put effort into it, it gets out of hand because I don't either have really good control or no control. I'm not really. The governor is missing in me somehow. Well, that's what I was going to do on that one. Well, I wanted to ask, So what do you feel like method like for working out eating? What do you feel? Is the method for you to lose the weight? Workout because you said you really like to cycle? I did. I had. I mean, I don't do cardio at all anymore. I mean, I do a little bit. So I think this is really specific to what your goal is and also to how much excess fat you have to lose. When I was 500 pounds in 500 plus, by the way, I did, I lost 80 pounds in two months on a liquid diet, and that was awesome. I've never that's that 80 pounds. I've never even come close to gaining that back. That has been gone for since day one. I've that has never been. I've never dipped back into those pounds. So if I had 80 pounds, I don't think I would do that. If I had 80 pounds from where I am now, I would take a totally different approach. Now, when I had, you know, 100 pounds to lose, I did keto because I don't have to think a lot with keto. It's like I cut out this whole food group as long as I'm not eating like hot dogs dipped in nacho cheese. I'm going to be OK, get my vegetables, get my high fat meats. I'm going to be OK. I wasn't gorging. You know, that's like a very easy, long term diet. But then when I start to go like, I want to see the muscle a bit more and like, fill out the muscle and then potentially gain muscle. I think that the bodybuilder diet is really the one that works for that. So now I'm on like super high protein, moderate to high carbs, low fat. And I lift heavyweights. And now, because I'm working out in my house, I lift not so heavy weights, just a s**tload of reps. You know, I'm doing different types of push ups every day to failure. You know, it's a whole different way of working out just the kind of I'm not building muscle, but I'm maintaining pretty well. Right, right. I like that. That's I like that. I do the same. I don't lift much, but I do a lot of reps. I feel like from my body type, that's what's best for me, too. Yeah, I totally feel you on that. Yeah, I think I think it. I don't believe I mean, listen, we could get super science and say the best, most efficient way to do to lose weight is X and like look at groups and statistical analysis and say the most people who lost weight and kept it off did it this way. Therefore, this is the best and it's like, OK, but I'm vegan, right? I'm not. I'm saying like, but if you are are right, then that doesn't work for you. You can't eat chicken breasts if you're vegan, you know. So. I think there has to be some personal. Exactly. Yeah. With weight loss. And I get asked this all the time when people see those like pictures on the internet, they're like, Oh, well, what did you do to get? Like, what's the secret and the thing that always bugged me was all my interview questions became that whenever I had anything coming up, oh well, what did you do need? No, no, what you really do? Because I was like, No, I allude to like steroids. Yeah. But you know, it was, oh, so you didn't take it. And I was like. And I was like, No, I just was miserable. To be honest, you want me to be honest, like if I want to be in good shape, I don't have to be miserable. But if I want to be that cut, I weighed all my food and I worked out. I was disciplined. Would you say finding a type of fitness you love is what made it total easier? Because I mean, some stuff just not fun for people. Yeah, 100 percent. I just think if we're going to look at anyone else and go, well, I have to do it that way. And it's something you're really not interested in, then I don't see how that's going to work, I think. I think a lot of these kind of analysis of diet and exercise kind of takes preference for granted. And I think preference is so huge. And now we could get back into my moral relativism where I go like, I don't know what's right for you, right? At the end of the day, here's what I did. If you find it helpful, that's awesome. But all I'm saying is this worked for me, right? I've done jujitsu is awesome. Yeah. And Muay Thai Muay Thai is awesome. That's not what I want to do every day. So if I go like, well, I have to do that because that's the best way to do it. And then I fail at that. Then I'm like, Well, I tried the best way and I failed. Why should I try another way? And I just think the better kind of model is like, I'm going to try a bunch of stuff. And by the way, if I love the first thing I try, I'm just going to keep doing that. And if I hate it, I'm not going to close myself off to all the other stuff. I'm going to try everything I've done, every single mainstream diet, every one of them. I've lost weight on every one of them. They all work. Some you're way more miserable on than other, like the f**king cayenne pepper lemonade diet. Oh my god, I might be, you know, horrible. It's awful. And and but you're going to you're you're going to see huge numbers on the scale and you're going to stop and you're going to be like, But I just drink lemonade and you're going to get dehydrated and like, there's a lot happening there. But, you know, I don't know why I say, check, I'm sorry, I say chicken. I say this word, chick, because I think I think chicks are the coolest and. Well, thank you. Yeah. Like, if I think it's an easier analogy to use a girl for this, I have four daughters, so I see this kind of thought process happen all the time. And I think guys do it too. I don't have four sons, so I don't know. All right. I know I do it sometimes where it's like, I want to lose eight pounds in the next week to fit into this dress that fit me last year. Mm hmm. Yeah, go ahead. Cayenne pepper. Yeah, it's only you're only going to be eight pounds less for a day. Yeah, but it work for a week. You'll be miserable. For a week. You'll have lost the weight. You'll fit in your dress for one day and then it will all go away if that's what you want. Fine, do that. Yeah, that's not what I want. But if that's what you know, if I had a suit that I needed to wear and I needed to lose 10 pounds this week, I might do something. Yeah, yeah, I think it's all preference. Like, What do you want? How are you going to get it? Like, you love jujitsu and more? I f**king awesome. You know, I loved bike riding for a while. That's what I did. Now I love lifting weights like I feel great lifting weights and thinking, What's your max bench? Press bench press four or five? Wow, I want that. There's no there's a little bit of an addendum to that, though. I was doing a TV show called Chance. I was eating everything in sight because the guy supposed to be big. So I was like, I'm not dieting at all. I mean, pizza and burgers, and I'm going to eat two of everything. And I was going to the gym every day and I was a lot bigger than I am now. I can bench press three, 15, no problem. Four reps. I don't think I can bench. I haven't tried to bench press four or five at the size I am now, but I doubt that I can do it, but I have bench that. And it wasn't just once, it was a couple of times. That's huge. Yeah, my boyfriend does the lifting and he does a lot of meats and stuff. And yeah, it's really cool to find out how much you guys can. I'm like four or five. That is absolutely mind blowing. Like at the end of the day, I go in the gym and I'm like, I don't give a s**t. Yeah, how many weights are on here? What is going to make me look like a Hemsworth? Yeah, it's all I care about. You know what I mean? Yeah, I feel like if I ever have to push 400 and five pounds off of my chest in a real life situation, maybe I got it. Maybe I don't. I've never had to. I doubt that I ever will. Right. I don't really care about the breathing component, but I know. Now that you're so comfortable and you look great and you know, you have this big beard, are you going to be in the next like SEAL Team six or what do you do? Your goals change acting wise as well as your fitness goals? My goals change acting wise. I mean, like, yeah, like I'm a bit of a conundrum. I love Austrian economics and French postmodernist philosophy and action thriller kind of mindless airport books. Yeah, I really those are my three categories, you know what I mean? Like, I've read all the Jack Reacher books, I've read all the Gabriel Anon books, Alan books I like. So yeah, that would be awesome. I'm not trying to do that. If that opportunity arises, I would. I would be in. But I I'm just like, I'm just happy with myself right now and I'm writing my own book, so I don't know. I don't know what I have left to do in acting acting for me. I feel like at this point, I'm either a whole new person that is accepted, and if I am, then that's great or I'm done. And either way, I feel like I've got a good career under my belt. But I'm I'm not really willing at this point to go back and be who I was when I was welcomed. That's amazing. Yeah, that's beautiful. That's that's kind of what the point of this podcast. Yeah. You know, it's it's like, what? Yeah. So what? What would you want to do after acting? I know you said you're writing. Yeah, I'm writing. I love doing the podcast. I love having conversations with people I don't know. I don't know. I sometimes fantasize about being a farmer, you know, like, I think that would be fun politics things. The minute they dig into my past, I'm done. Yeah. I don't get past anybody's vetting. Yeah, that's not. Don't get into that. If someone wanted to take the first step, OK, they're, you know, they want to lose weight. They don't know where to start. What would you think the first step is? Yeah, I think the first step, which, you know, it's kind of tricky, like, I'm a sober guy and I and I've had a lot of help maintaining sobriety. I'm one of the first steps of that is like recognizing that it's maybe something you can't control on your own. And so what's worked for me in both with food and substances is going like to another person who seems to have their s**t in order going like, Hey, I've got a problem with this and I need help. Can you help me make a plan? And then it's just kind of sticking to that plan, and I don't believe that you have to be powerless forever. I think you can build power and amass power, but it takes work, you know what I mean? It's not. I think the first step is just a decision away, but I don't know that you can just go like, I'm going to decide to be powerful over this today with no plan at all. And then you've just won. I don't know that that hasn't worked for me. Maybe it can work for someone, but for me, it was reaching out to people and kind of turning the responsibility over to them and then following their lead so that I can get my s**t together and figure out for myself how to do this if that makes sense. And do you feel sobriety was easier once you started losing weight? Were your substance abuse issues tied in with your weight, or was it more a career thing or what? What do you think that tied into? Yeah, I think they both kind of went hand-in-hand to like an inability to kind of like be comfortable and present in the moment, if that makes sense, like it's an escape into something else into like a base physical sensory thing versus just being open to like whatever's happening outside of me, it all became internal. And both of them, food and drugs and alcohol were like disconnect from being present. So I think being comfortable is a big component and being willing to like, look around and go like, what's actually happening right now? And let me let me engage with people and like, observe things rather than shutting down and just being internal all the time. Did it seems like you had an amazing support system, you know your wife and then you have your family, your four girls? Like, that's you know, I feel like that definitely really helps. And every day just, you know, wanting to make them happy and show them, Yeah, I really don't. There's so much that I tried to like I wanted. I have these ideas of like just to I talk about white knuckling your way through stuff, and I I want that to be true. I don't think it is. And again, we get into the problem of like objective versus subjective truth here. But I go like, for me, I've always relied on people. Everything I do, I, I have groups of people that are helping me do them. So I recall. To other people, and especially when I can't if I'm failing at something, there is nothing wrong with being humbling going, I'm failing at this. Help me, you know, and being open to the help and like aware of like our shortcomings. And I think the biggest failing I've ever had is going into anything and thinking like, I already understand this. I know how it works. I can do it now. Not, you know. Even Michael Jordan, I think, you know, the he's just had this wonderful documentary out, right? People are freaking out about it. But the biggest thing is like the best guy was also coachable. You know what I mean? Always a student, always a student, always a teammate was not an island out there just shooting three points all day long. He was a member of a team and like relied on people and like, who f**king knew Dennis Rodman was such a bad a*s? I certainly don't remember that. You know, I know he's like a wild dude and all of that. That's what I remember him as well. Like, he was a necessary part of that team painted him in a totally different picture that I don't think anybody had known or seen. No idea. But like, he was integral to Michael Jordan. And I think that you could use that with anything like my wife is a necessary component to my daily life, and my children are two and my friends and it branches out and my groups. So I think that can you crack a book and use the book? Have that book be your source material of like, I can't be responsible. The book is going to be OK. Sure. But I think it's helpful also to have a team working with you, whether it's an associate at work or a sister or brother or girlfriend or wife or whatever a husband. I said all those from a male perspective, I apologize. A husband is also super good. I find that other people are really necessary. Yeah, yeah, I I completely agree with that. Yeah. I think also it's so important who you pick for part of that team. I've noticed and I was going to ask about this with both of you today. Have you ever felt this is so weird? And I just noticed this in the last few years, fitness shamed. I feel like you don't have to go work out today. You already workout enough. You don't have to do this. Whenever I've had goals, I feel like there's always someone picking at it and it's like, sometimes it's your good friends are like, Hey, man, like, I'm trying to better myself. Like, I could be like, Hey, I'm trying to read more books. I want to be smarter, you know? And someone's like, What do you mean you don't want to go out on Friday? Like, Yeah, you know, and I just I was wondering if you guys had any experiences with that speaking to like picking your team of people? Totally. And and, you know, even occasionally your team can turn on you. And I think it's important to have a team who who will hold you accountable. Yeah. Yeah, they've got to be on the same page with your team. And if you if if you're suddenly bringing like opposing team mates in and pretending they're on your team, that's no good. Yeah. You know, look, I don't really eat out at restaurants with my wife and kids, and my wife is like, I like to go out to dinner, sometimes a*****e. When I, you know, like you and you want to bring your own food and Tupperware and sneak it and just like their thing. Yeah, and I'll sit in the car with her and eat my food in the car and then go into the restaurant and watch her. And she's like, This is bulls**t. This is not. We're not on a date right now. Yeah, yeah. So I think there's got to be some balance to, you know, if your team likes to go out and do shots and you have just exercised yourself free group like you find something else to do with them. Yeah. But yeah, I think you got to be you. They got to be able to hold you accountable and you also got to be able to, like, give them what they need to. Yeah, because that's one of the hardest things that's stood in the way of me and fitness, whether it be fitness goals, im career goals, I want to stay in and I want to work on something. I want to stay and I want to better myself in some way. There's people who don't think they're being a bad team member who are like, Come on, man, you can have one drink or you can have one cheeseburger. You can have, you know, you can have one night out and you're like, No, I'm working on this thing. I want to stay in. And that's always been a struggle for me, and I've had to reevaluate where I even hang out with the last like, well, I moved out 10, 11 years ago. I think where you are in whatever your version of greatness is, I think you ought to be select so carefully who who you allow, you know, to be a voice in your head. Yeah, 100 percent in your. You also have to be aware, like there are a lot of people out there who maybe had goals that they didn't achieve, who then are going to try to rationalize that by encouraging you to not achieve your goals? Does that make sense, which is a s**tty thing to do? I think like I might have s**tty thoughts sometimes because I think no person's incapable of having just pure like, we're not all, just pure. I think we have. Voices, right? And so but what I would try to put out there is only encouragement if somebody's got a goal, I want them to achieve it, you know, unless it's like they've got a goal to jump off a bridge, I might try to discourage. Yeah, yeah. But like, if it's a it's a productive goal, I would be super encouraging and I would take something like that, like somebody going, Why are you doing this? Like? Well, I think it's a very easily answerable thing. I love doing it. I'm into it. This just makes me happy. I have goals. I'm going after my goals and then I would just feel kind of empathy for that person and go, like, maybe they missed a few of their goals or, you know, whatever is going on that they would be trying to talk you out of it. But yeah, I think you're right that the team is important. Hollywood is full of people who have not achieve their goals, who are going to try to rationalize that by getting you to not achieve your goals. You know, like I think the Screen Actors Guild has the highest rate of unemployment of any union on Earth. You know, that's a lot of people who are not doing what they want to be doing. Yeah, I liked listening to your podcast saying you don't believe in universal rules you don't believe in. And for most things, and I think that goes with a lot of things in life, whether it be, you know, creative pursuit. I think that you run into people all the time or trying to nab at that or they haven't achieved it themselves. And I think it's so important to have that team with on your podcast. How did your how did you originally get the idea to have your podcast, Kevin? Kevin Connolly Yeah. Oh, Kevin Connolly was building this wonderful space even before he was building this, and he was telling me, Well, let's go back further than this because it even starts further. I'm going to bring it all back and take the credit from him and give it back to myself. Watch this Kevin and I were getting on a plane to go to Japan together a long time ago, and Kevin said, What are you going to do for 12 hours? And I said, I'm going to listen to the story of the Mongols. And he was like, What are you talking about? I said, Give me your phone and download downloaded Dan Carlin's hardcore history. Kevin, listen to it straight through the whole flight. I slept. I've listened to them five times. Yeah, the greatest minds went downhill from there. Yeah. Right. He's made history. He started out with like, yeah, what is arguably one of the best? I mean, it's an audio book, really, but it's like 14 hours of material talked about, Oh, we got off the plane. I was maybe through one episode. Kevin, listen to the whole thing and was like, I'm starting over, like, we're getting in the car, I'm starting to listen for more. And this was amazing. I can't believe, how did I not know about this? And then he, like, got really into podcast. This was years ago, and he went, I really like podcasts. I want to give people a place to do podcasts. I'm building a studio and I was like, That's great. And he said, You got to come do a podcast. And I was like, What the f**k am I going to talk about? And he said, politics. And I said, I don't, yeah, eat this like I will my my acting career. I'll definitely be over. I have nothing but bad ideas. I basically want all politics abolished. That's my big political idea. Like, let's get rid of everything. Start over. There's no way I'm talking about that. And Kevin was like, I know, I just know you can do something. And I I was exercising. I'd lost a bunch of weight. I felt good about health, and I was like, What about health? And he was like, OK, we'll try that. And we tried it and people liked it. That's amazing. Have you been really happy with the response? Yeah, yeah. Who have you had on? Who do you usually have on? I've had all kinds of people from Hilaria Baldwin to my good friend Nick Cassavetes to John Cloud, who is obese to be on Instagram. Follow him. He's awesome. He's amazing. He's awesome. Mike is writable, who's like a super sciencey, nerdy bodybuilder, animal jujitsu guy. Basically, I get to have a conversation that I like having. And then I get access to like people like Mike Hazratbal, who like I otherwise. I mean, he's like a Ph.D. in physiology guy, like super smart unreachable. You know what I mean? Like to train with him is insanely expensive. And now I get to like, go and train with him and talk to. Yeah, it's awesome. And then other people who have lost weight or like a buddy of mine, Michael Malice, who is trying to gain weight and gain muscle. And it's kind of the opposite, but it's still a physical goal. And he is actually said some interesting stuff to me, he said. Like, if you look at what you've done, you've saved a life. And I said, f**k Michael, that's too much pressure if we really think that way. Maybe I've killed someone too. Like, How can we do this to ourselves? Which is like, f**king you turned it back. But but, you know, if I take what he's saying and I acknowledge it from like, like not trying to belittle myself, I think that it is possible that just setting an example can help someone. And just in doing that, I'm very happy. Thank you so much, that's that. I mean, this is all been this is so amazing. So you have you have American glutton. And then you have a book you're writing. Yeah, I mean, it's going to take a long time to write it. And there's a lot of like not safe for television stuff. Which I don't know if my wife is going to allow at the end of the day. We'll see. We'll see what happens with that. Maybe it just becomes a diet book at the end of it, but it's got a lot of stories in my life. Yeah. Thank you so much. This has been so valuable and it's exciting to see your journey and being a big fan growing up like you were. You were talked about in my household. Oh, it's also we're like, we're like, we love because me and my mom would get really nerdy about movies. Yeah. You know, when I really made it what I want to do with my life, I look at actors like you and be like, That's that's a f**king career right there. That's awesome. Thank you. Really big fan. I'm so excited you came in. Thanks for having me on, guys. I appreciate it and thank you for sharing your story. You're very amazing to hear. Thank you. Well, that wraps up this exciting episode of Comeback Kids. I'm Jonathan Loop Nicky, and I'm Barbie Blank. Thank you so much. Please subscribe. If you dig what we've been putting out and we'll see you next time on Comeback Kid. Don't call it a comeback. I've been here for a rock, in my opinion. Bill, making the team break down like a makes whole team. Competitive breakfast.
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