RFK Jr. Suspends Campaign and Endorses Trump - Impact on the Election, Important Issues and What happens next?

Transcript

The following program is a podcast 1.comproduction. From Hollywood, California by way of the Broken Skull Ranch, this is The Steve Austin Show. Give me a hell yeah. Hell yeah. Now here's Steve Austin. I just hit the record button. I'm standing here with Holly Heyman. All dangerously. Holly Heyman. It's all dangerous. Okay. So here here it is. So we was, hanging around here in New Orleans here at the hotel, and I just got there to see breakfast. Kevin Nash walking to the green room. See you about 40 yards away. A big smile on your face. A big smile on my face. A big a*s hug. Hey. What are you doing? Nothing. Just hanging around. Can you do a podcast? When? Now. So here we are. I haven't done any research. We know each other, pretty damn well. And so here we are, WrestleMania 30. You grew up in a business. All of a sudden, now 30 years down the road, what is what is WrestleMania 30 mean to you? Well, it's the evolution of the industry. I mean, once once WCW and ECW all folded into WWE and was the consolidation of the industry, it truly became the centerpiece event of the year. So to me, this is where the 2013, 2014 season ends and the 2014, 2015 season begins. But it's bigger than ever. I mean, the wrestling keeps growing. And right when you think it can't get any bigger, they go to a bigger building. It blows out, and it's just, it's a phenomenon. Well, consider who the promoter is. I mean, that's a Back in the day, Jesus Christ, you know, to come up with the idea to go pay per view, and now all the success and all the mainstream stuff that goes with it. Oh, wasn't the first WrestleMania just on closed circuit? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. But I think I think the I think it's the second one where he went where he won pay per view when he did New York, Chicago, and LA. And, I mean, listen. Vince is all and you know this better far better than I do. You know? Vince has always been the big thinker, and he doesn't like to do anything on a small basis. And like any corporate owner, this year's quarter better exceed last year's quarter or your stock goes down. And, ultimately, what the company is about today is about the stock price. So in order to drive that stock price up, your earnings capacity have to be bigger this year. You have to beat projections this year more than you beat last year. And to Vince, that means a bigger spectacle. Okay. So we're talking about big spectacles. Let's talk, briefly about the WWE Network. When you heard about this, what were what were your thoughts? Because it's groundbreaking. You know, another, cool moment. And this also, speaking to your stock stuff, drives the stock prices up. Have you subscribed to the network yet? Well, anybody who works for the company gets a free subscription. Ain't nobody told me that. I technically still work with a company. How come I ain't got no free pass? I think well, number 1, I think technically is the first word that you have to work for the company, and I don't know how many of their phone calls you actually return during the year. Gotcha. So have you been on the network? How is it? I I have been on the network. My kids are on it form far more than I am, and they get to tease me a lot because they get to see all my old footage, which I thought I, you know, I could block on YouTube. But now I can't because it's on the network. I I like the new stuff. Here's what I find about the network. Again, I kinda look at it from a different perspective than most people. I look at it as a former promoter and understanding that the choke point, when you are a promoter comes down to 2 things, 1, content and 2, distribution. Now in some people, it's financing, but this company's always been very well financed. Right. But you have the monster of content to feed, and then you have the con and then you have the monster of distribution to find. So what Vince did was brilliant. He self distributed. Because he realized that any distribution that he has, the distributors are gonna take the money, which was his beef with pay per view to begin with. So now he self distributes. It's all his. It's all the shareholders. It's all for the company. And it was just it was it was the the right move to make. I also gotta say, I think it was the only real move for him to make. Right. Because had he gone the route of buying a smaller cable network to expand it like what Oprah did, Oprah went $300,000,000 in. Right. It it it it it's a you're gambling the entire store that way. If this network were to go completely wrong for him, he has an escape valve. He doesn't have to lose the company on it. The other way is you're gambling the whole farm Right. Or the ranch, whichever the Yeah. Yeah. Let's go to the ranch. Okay. Hey. Hey. Back in the day, before even, you and I started hanging around together, when you when you started managing me, you had the big a*s cell phone. Did you ever think that the business would evolve to what it has today? Just as far as the technology, the the WWE Network with WrestleMania being this big. Because it was this is I mean, we were living the times of our life, and you and and we still are, but you're still in the business. It was such a grassroots affair back then. And with all the technology, with all the production values, it just keeps increasing. It keeps changing. The product has changed, inside the ring. Oh, again, I I have I think that has to do with the distribution channels that are out there. I mean, could we have envisioned where technology would be today? Back then, you know, I mean, we're talking about now you and I worked together in 1991. So back then, again, it was the age of big a*s cell phones. It was the it was the age of mimeographs. You put a cassette into into the tape into a tape player in a car. Now if I would've turned to my kids today and go, hey. Put the tape in, they're gonna look at me like, okay. Daddy's really old, and he's talking about back in his day. Yeah. So, I mean, it again, it's all about distribution channels. We live in a global village to where right now, whatever is happening in Sydney, Australia or Johannesburg or Tel Aviv or Athens or Johannesburg or Tel Aviv or Athens or London or Paris or Rome, you can see on yourself. FaceTime. You can FaceTime with your family right now. So when you're on the road back then, you have to pull over to pay phone. You had a you had a call from a cell phone, which is expensive. You you have to wait to get your hotel room and call your family. I can be right now completely around the world. I can be in Antarctica, and I can FaceTime with my children. Right. It's distribution. And Vince went with the distribution channels that was out there. And if he didn't, someone else would have. If Ted Turner had seen the distribution channels, then no matter how bad the creative was at WCW, they would've still be alive. Hey, man. You've had your highs and lows with WWE. Knockdown, dragouts. And I'm surprised it's still with the company, and you're cutting badass promos every single week. I didn't envision you, you know, being a part of the company because it seems like, man, when y'all had a falling out, it was a big a*s falling out for whatever reason it was. And so now you're happy as a clam. How how's the the current regime here and current day WWE? I think I have a much better relationship with them now because they don't get to see me that often. I'm not on the writing team. I'm not involved in creative. No. Why? Because I had the time of my life doing it, but that that's over. And and it's it's But do you still have that part of your brain where it's like, gosh. You would like to chip in on some of this stuff, or are you doing it within, your and Brock's store launch? I chip in on the things that I'm directly involved in. And if I have something to say about something that I see, I will speak to the person directly. So if they wanna pitch it, they're welcome to. And if they don't, then they don't have to. I I don't get emotionally involved in the other segments of the show anymore. Right. I've learned to just say, okay. That's what they wanna do. Good for them. Now if a talent comes up to me and say, hey. Did you watch my segment? Yeah. They may get a very intense, passionate answer. Right. But I'm not willing to fight to the death over 2 words that are in a promo anymore. Now coming from your background, I mean, I put you over in a in a 1,000,000 interviews because it's all true. You helped me so much when I went down to ECW with the superstar Steve Austin, the phone call. You're the first guy to call me. Steve, what are you doing? No. I got a busted arm. I want you to come work for me. Can't work. Got a busted arm. Anyway, you you helped me, you know, harness and focus my energy and develop a good promo. So so that being said, with all the success of you that you had at ECW with helping all these different personas, characters, people, define themselves and turn out great gimmicks and promos, how much of the current roster is coming up to you on a daily basis saying, Pauley, check this out, or ask like like we just talked about your opinion of something and ask for your advice as a teacher, a mentor? A lot. You know? And it's funny because I used to be the kid in the locker room that had all these ideas that could revolutionize the business. And and now I'm the old guy in the locker room with these ideas that I hope can still revolutionize the business. I just don't give them to the promoters or try to feed them to the other writers or producers slash agents anymore. Now when a talent comes up to me, if a Bray Wyatt will come up to me or a Roman Reigns or a Seth Rollins or a Dean Ambrose or any of these or or and even from, you know, from the girl's side, an AJ Lee, a a a Natty Neidhart will come up to me and they'll ask me something. I'll give them an, you know, an answer from my perspective. And I I that's the avenue for my passion in terms of helping somebody out or or sharing a vision with somebody. What's what's your, current schedule on the road? You're living in New York. Right? Yes. So how often are you on the road? I've rare now. Now I'm pretty much on Brock's schedule, plus I make the TVs that he doesn't make. So I I leave home on Sundays. I I make TVs on Mondays. If they need me on SmackDown, I'll go to SmackDown on Tuesdays, and I go home the 1st flight in the morning the next day. Now before this, when Centimeters Punk and I were were, were opposing each other, it it got so hot that I started making all the house shows again. And I did that for a couple months and burned myself out and desperately needed a few weeks off to recharge the batteries until Brock came back. My my schedule is a blessing right now. I I really work very, very little. You brought up Centimeters Punk. I don't know when this podcast is gonna come out. It would be after WrestleMania. I predicted, a couple weeks ago that Centimeters Punk will return at WrestleMania 30. Here we are talking. Is he gonna come back? We are 48 hours away from WrestleMania. And unless a really wild move is pulled before then or and or at least a first conversation between Vince and Punk happens, he will not be at WrestleMania. When's the last time you talked to Sam Punk? Oh, I talk to him all the time. I don't really talk about the industry that much because it's obviously a sore spot with him. But when when when you left the company, I'm sure you had very select friends that you could talk with and who could talk with you. And it doesn't have to be, hey. What was said about me in the locker room or or, hey. Did you hear anything? Or they say to you, hey. You're coming back. I'm sure it could be, hey. How are your kids? Hey. How are you feeling today? Hey. You're okay? Everything cool or everything not okay? You wanna talk about anything? When I left the company, I stayed very good friends with people who were still in the company. It it it doesn't mean just because punk has left the company, we can't be friends. Our friendship really had funny thing to say, but it really had nothing to do with business. Right. I I I think when you talk about Centimeters Punk slash Phil Brooks, there were 3 people in the room the night that he quit, Vince McMahon, Triple H, and Centimeters Punk. I don't know what went on in that room. I know certain perspectives, but none of those 3 have talked in public about it. If 1, 2, or 3 of them decide to go public, then we'll get a perspective on what happened that day. Until 1 of the 3 of them speak about it, it's only rumor and speculation and gossip. You know? How's he doing? He's fine. Does he miss the business? I don't think so. I never ask him if he misses the business because he just walked out 6 to 8 weeks ago. I ask him, how are you doing? How are you feeling today? How's your diet going? What'd you eat? Hey. Did you did you watch did you watch the season finale of true detective? We talked about true detective on on, you know, for hours, but do we talk about WWE? It's very rare. I've been I've been meaning to, watch true detective. Everybody says it's a badass show. Should I watch it? Absolutely. Absolutely. It's amazing. The character development on that show is the best I have seen since whether you're a Breaking Bad fan or a Sopranos fan or a fan of The Shield, I think those 3 shows revolutionized the way the characters are presented on television. Any of those 3 shows, in my opinion, and I was a huge Sopranos fan, I think they pale in comparison to True Detective. Most fascinating show I've seen on television in years. 2 words you just said, character development. Let's go back to WWE. Man, you've got some, young cats coming up in the, program there. The Wyatts, 3 badass kids, and and a couple of them been have been around for a while. Luke Harper's been around a while. I don't know, how long Eric Rowan's been around, but Bray Wyatt's coming into his own run for the last year has been done so in the ring and on the mic. Also, you've got, 3 Badass Cats with The Shield. Those guys, you got Antonio Cesaro. Did you work with, Antonio Cesaro back in the day? No. I would love to, though. Okay. But, anyway, here's another bright spot, on the, on the the blip, on the radar. So character development in the WWE. Some of the gimmicks they've given some of these guys has been a little lackadaisical at best. What they do it over there to to, help these kids find an identity? And certainly the guys at Shield, guys in the whites have done a tremendous job. And Tournemouth Cezzaro, he had a hell of a match with, John Cena a couple of months ago. Premier talent, physical specimen, bad a*s cat. I see money on him. Maybe not in the current gimmick, but there's money in that kid. So what what are they doing to try to help these kids? What's what's programmed now? Because in ECW, everybody that came through there, you helped really, hone and define who people, or or define help them find their strong points and stay away from their weak points. I think in ECW, we had the opportunity that I took myself as a director or writer or producer seriously to the point where my goal in that company was to take a Steve Austin who was misused by WCW or a Mick Foley who was misused by WCW or a Shane Douglas who never had a real opportunity to shine in in a leader in a leadership role and to produce and direct and and refine and and help those talents find themselves. You know? If if if you watch an Al Pacino or a Robert De Niro or a Harvey Keitel or a Dustin Hoffman. Now if if they just work on a movie, they they usually become caricatures of themselves. But once a once a Scorsese or a Coppola or a Milose Forman or a Sidney Lumet gets their hands on these performers, these these directors will pull a performance out of these out of these actors that they themselves never knew existed. So my ego in ECW was, hey. I wanna be that guy. I wanna find something inside this performer that no one else in this business has the wherewithal to pull that out of them and then show that performer, hey. You can do this on your own, which is why to this day, now 19 years after you worked in ECW, you still bestow upon me all this praise when all I really did was just say, hey. What's inside of you? Right. And once you tapped into it, you knew you didn't need me to bring it out of you. So what happens in WWE today, however, is that if you don't have the assertiveness and the wherewithal to find it yourself, then they don't think you have what it takes to stay a top guy. Could they plug you in to be a top guy? Absolutely. Jack Swagger was a top guy for a moment. Sheamus was a top guy for a moment. The Miz was a top guy. He may have entered a WrestleMania, which is a sore spot with Centimeters Punk. And and and he was a top guy for a moment too. Whether they had what it took to then take those characters to the next level to become a global persona and have box office and merchandise and licensing appeal on a on a global basis. Obviously, at one point, Vince McMahon said, not this guy this time. The question that I would have to answer your question is how much merchandising money did you make on Vince McMahon's vision of the ringmaster? Man, not too much. And how much money did Vince McMahon make on your vision of Stone Cold Steel, Austin? And that's the point. You had to you had to come up with it yourself. I had to come up with it myself, but but is WWE creative doing everything that they can, to to get these cats pointed in the right direction? I think the training facility down in Florida is a great idea because all the territories are gone. There's no other place to really learn. Indies are getting picked. They're pretty thin anyway. And so looking for premier grade a people, I know now they're looking to, you know, recruit wrestlers, you know, from the division 1, 2 stuff and colleges, ex football players from top college and pro programs, with athletic ability and a look. And then you gotta put the rest of it into them, but they're starting with some good raw materials. But just from a character standpoint, are they doing all that they can? Are are they open minded enough? You know, take for instance, when Damon Sandow came out. Great name. I thought, you know, everybody's kinda talking this guy up, and then he came out with pink trunks. You handed him an anvil right off the get go, in my opinion. But, you know, you know this as well as I do. Sometimes they expect you to say, wait a minute. Don't give me the pink trunks. And But my point is people are on eggshells. People are too scared to say, I can't wear pink trunks. Then shouldn't the criticism be on the talent that's on the eggshells and not on the people who sit there and say, hey. Those who walk on eggshells are just gonna be roster fillers. I'm looking for the guy that's gonna say, no. Don't put me in the pink tights. I'll take my beatings. And you know what? If you fire me, I'm gonna go make money elsewhere, and you're gonna have to pay me more money to come back. Sometimes you gotta make chicken salad out of chicken. And I remember when I came in as a ringmaster that I am in in, Atlanta, Georgia. Here comes Vince calling my phone. I'm starting to work with ECW, working with you. Hey, Steve. Vince McMahon. Hey. How are you doing, pal? And I'd already talked to Vince 2 or 3 times. You know? I know he had plans for me as a mechanic and a mechanic owner, never to be a star. And he goes, yeah. Let's bow. I wanna bring in and call you the ring master. You know, the master of the ring. But Ted DiBiase is your manager. You'd be the $1,000,000 champion. Come in as champion. Blah blah blah. Well, of course, I went to meet with Terry Anderson, the, you know, the girls who do the wardrobe, and they wanted me in the money green trunks. And I'm like, first, they wanted me to wear a singlet. I said no to the singlet, but I had to give them something. So I acquiesced and said, okay. I'll wear the green trunks. I think I wore it for 2 TVs instead of going back my black. You know? And then that's when I kinda started doing my own thing. And the ring the ring master sucked. 6 months later, I said, hey, man. Not so much. Let's try this stone cold. But anyway, so the I just think that man, just from a visual standpoint, that's not a striking image. It's a cat and pig. It worked great for Brett Hart. I still see potential in this kid, Kenny. Turn it around, Kenny, you know, dig inside his brain, his heart, and find something to to make chicken salad chicken But you see, that's the same thing. Most guys today won't go even as far as saying I won't wear the singlet. Right. That's it. See, that very first move you said was no. I you just said it here. You go, I said no to the singlet. And you said no to the singlet right there. Most guys don't have the balls to say no to the singlet Right. Or then to say, okay. Listen. I know you want me to wear green. I got the gimmick. Right. I'm gonna wear the green tights, but I can't do it in a singlet. And now I'm 2 weeks into the green. Hey. I've tried it your way. It's not working for me. I wanna go with the black. Most guys won't even get past the whole singlet thing. Right. And that's the thing. And what they're looking for is someone who has the assertiveness, the talent, and the ability. Like, right now, you're looking straight into my eyes. And most people don't have that, and that's why they're roster fillers. It's the guys that sit there and say, okay. You can fire me. I'm gonna go to Japan. I'm gonna go to Mexico. I'll go to ring of honor. I'll go to Dragon Gate USA. I'll go on the indie circuit and make such a splash there. You'll have no choice but to hire me. But by the way, when I come back, it's gonna cost you more money. And they sit there, who is this guy? Right. And and someone in the back goes, you know who that guy is? That's our next top talent. Right. The Steve Austin Show. The Steve Austin Show. Pluto TV is the place for movie fans like me. And TV fans like me. They've got something for everyone, and it's totally free. You can binge laugh out loud sick like Frasier. And rewatch cult classics like Higher Learning. Oh. Whether you're in the mood to solve a little crime before bedtime with MCIS or Tracker. Or curl up with a surefire hit like Forrest Gump. Run, Forrest. Pluto TV has thousands of movies and shows all for free. Pluto TV. Stream now. Pay never. I got down in ECW when you guys got those heavy promos, and I came along and uncorked at 1. It's about 4:30 in the morning. Right. And, you know, all of the guys because I was a new kid on the block. And, all of a sudden, it came my time. I I I cut about a 7 minute promo with the with, your direction. But my the question is this. There were so many guys cutting such heavy duty promos from Raven to Cactus Jack to Shane Douglas, to Sandman. I mean, it was just everybody had a damn good promo. Was there any and and I really love Shane Shane Douglas' promos back in. Man, he was just bitter. I mean, he would just he laid it all on the line. And, of course, Yo, Mick would would weave these, just, promos with so many layers and levels and and, intricacies and and, they were complex, and there were just so many stories and everything that he was saying. But I I really enjoyed Shane Douglas's promos a whole lot there. And, of course, Raven was off the chart too. Did you have a a favorite promo back in the day or a promo guy? This is gonna sound like a cop out answer, but it really depended on the week. I was a huge fan of the Raven character. Yeah. I I was too. And And the look. Yes. Well, you know you know what else? It was something those who know Scott Levy Yeah. Who is as childish and immature and ridiculous of a human being as you can ever meet in your life. I've traveled with him for a couple of years. True. Eddie. Wonderful guy. Eddie, here's a guy here's a character that never smiled. He never broke character. And even when we put goofs around him like Stevie Richards and the Blue Meanie, the blue Meanie could be doing the most absurd things in the ring, and Raven would not even smirk. Right. He was so into that character that Raven was the antithesis of Scott Levy. And then you take into effect take into account that everything the character Raven said was actually sympathetic. I come from a broken childhood. I come from a from a destitute family. I come from a drunken father. My mother beat the living crap out of me. I never had love as a child. All I seek is your love and your affirmation of the audience. And it's such a sympathetic character, but what he did with that character and the manner in which he delivered it and the actions that his character took to vent his frustration made him heal. This guy was at the time, I dare say in 1995, one of the best performers in the industry, not only on the mic, but I I would say in the ring. Right. And yet even that crowd, the smart Philadelphia crowd, the the smartest, you know, the the smarts, and, oh, these are the you know, this is the smartest crowd in the industry, and nobody cheered them. He outsmarted them. Not you never heard a raven chant. You never heard people pop for him. This guy played a heel, and he was such a heel and so great at it that no matter how sympathetic a story he told, you still hated his guts. And to me, that was the it was so brilliant. Yeah. I was in awe of it. I liked Mick Foley's promos too. Right. When he started cutting nose, I mean, that was just there wasn't a lot of direction on that. That was just Yeah. It's kinda hard to direct at. Yeah. You know? Hey. What, you know, what what am I doing here? Okay. Well, here's what we're selling. Okay. Give me a few minutes, and he'd come back in and say he's ready. And, I mean, here was my big direction. Light them from underneath, shoot them from over top, and just go. And that was it. Right. With you, my job was really easy with you. I talked to you on the phone. You know? What do you want me to say? Hey. You pissed off? I'm pissed off. Say you're pissed off. Who am I pissed off at? b***h off. I could say that. Yeah. Go ahead. Say it. So you come in, and you think I'm gonna put you on first because we're buddies. And I said, you're next. And you go, okay. Any pit bulls? I like these guys. They're cool catch. I'm gonna watch them. Okay. Hey. Can you watch the next guy too? Yeah. Hell. Why not? I got nothing else to do. And by the night, you go, hey. You know, it's 2 o'clock in the morning. Hey. You're next. It was 4:30. But but but yeah. Because that that's the whole point. I made you wait and wait, and you had the promo in your head because you you spent you spent half the week thinking about all you're gonna say about Bischoff. No. Well, I didn't really know what I was gonna say. It was total shoot. I mean, from word go. Right. I know we really nothing mapped out. It was a one take deal. Right. And it was it was it was all or nothing. But that was the whole thing. My my whole thing of producing you and directing you was to make you wait as long as I can make you wait so that by the time we put you in front of that camera, you were so ramped and so amped and so competitive. Because I remembered that about you. I remembered you would never wanna do promos before Rick Rude. You wanted to do promos after Rick Rude because he was so good. Yeah. And it gave you something to shoot for. Gave you someone to compete with. Right. So, you know, and and that also came from the time you were in the ring with Ricky Steamboat because you knew all the great matches he had before, and you're like, oh, okay. I I wanna I wanna be one of his favorite opponents because you knew he was gonna be one of yours. Right. So I knew as long as that the longer I made you wait and we had Shane Douglas talk and this guy talking, that guy talk, the longer I made you wait, the better your promo is gonna be. Hey. Did you ever see, someone sent me Meanie sent me Barbed Wire City, ECW. Did you see that DVD? I honestly didn't. Man, you gotta see it. It just looked like, it looked like a meat grinder. And there there was just so much violence and stuff that was going on over there. And believe me, I was remember the 1st night in? That was when Mick and Terry Funk were out there in the steel chair, had the flame on it, and it shot off and it caught the dude up on the front row. It's like, Jesus Christ. I just got a job. I'm not having a job very long because they did burn up the guy in the front row. Do you remember calling me that week, by the way? Yeah. He called Steve called me that week, and he goes, hey. Are we gonna be okay? Well, I hadn't worked. I mean, I just got fired, and I was look. You know, just had a family, a house on 10 acres, gotta make the payments. You know? And it's not like I was gonna get rich working with ECW, but it was a weekly paycheck. Right. So I didn't want my weekly paycheck to disappear. But but it it was just, when when when you look back at that time, was it too violent? Was there any way was there anywhere for that promotion to keep growing? Because, I mean, everything but the kitchen sink was happening seemingly almost in every match and certainly by the semi and the main event. If I were to do a product today, there are many things that we did back in the nineties that there is absolutely no way to do today. Right. I mean, the first thing I'll do Because of PC or what? Well, just on a on a conscious level, I would never allow a chair shot to the head again. Right. Never. Wouldn't do it. I don't I don't care who you are. But then and we're and we're speaking hindsight 2020. Right. Right. We didn't know back then Right. What the the damage these chair shots to the head could do. And, I mean, today, I I would never I don't I don't care. If I own my own promotion, I had 1,000,000,000 of dollars in financing. Paul, you can do anything you want. I I could I could not in good conscience allow a chair shot to the head. Today, they're very squeamish about blood. I'm a fan of blood. Same here. I believe that blood is a part of the business, and I believe if done judiciously and right Yes. Even if it takes someone to take a hard way Yes. Blood is a major commodity in the business, all the way going back to the old school promoters saying red turns to green. Right. I do understand, though, the sensitivity to it, and that's part of the progression of the industry to be mainstream and global. If you want the United States military to be a sponsor, if you want Mattel to do your toys and not one of these doll makers, but you want the globally prestigious Mattel, these are the concessions that you have to make. Was it too violent for its time? I certainly didn't think so in 1995. I certainly didn't think so in 96 or even in 97. I tried to incorporate the Eddie Guerrero's and the Dean Malankos and the Chris Benoit's and then the Ray Mysterios and the Huguen Tude Guerreras and the Michinoco pro guys. And the last storm. And the last storm. Hey. Steve Austin, Shane Douglas, Taz. You know, Taz wasn't a violent guy. The the whole gimmick of Taz in being a UFC style wrestler was and his his his his mantra, I don't need a weapon. My hands are my weapons. Right. Because to me, the whole thing was you can hit him with a chair. You can swing a barbed wire baseball bat. You can throw fire. You can hit him with the kitchen sink. You can stab him in the head with a pencil. You can put a staple gun up against his eardrum. At the end of the day, if he gets his hands on you, he's gonna choke you out because he's a wrestler. Right. Now if I had access to more of that style, I would have probably progressed the style based on the success of a Taz or even someone who I thought was always a hybrid version of the violence and the shoot style and the high flying, which was Rob Van Dam. Right. I thought Rob Van Dam, if you look back on ECW and you say to me, who's the one guy that defines the ECW brand? My answer would be Rob Van Dam. Really? Yeah. Because well, besides the fact, he wasn't a great talker, but his talk in ECW resonated with the audience because it was him. He was a he was a genuine character. He talked about being stoned because he was. Right. And he talked about, hey. I'm Rob Van Dam. I'm the coolest dude out there, there, and this is the way it is, man. Because I'm then he do the double thumbs, Rob Van Dam. Yeah. So he wasn't a great talker, but he was effective for his role. But Rob could fly. Rob could wrestle. Rob could do strong style. Rob could do the chairs and everything else. In fact, his famous finishes were with chairs. Right. So I thought that he was the most hybrid style. He had evolved the style into something that was truly extreme, but not just bloodshed and mayhem. Violence for the sake of violence. You know? He was doing his yeah. If I could find people that could work, you know, if it I mean, I think The Sandman always had his place even if it's just an entrance. It was the interaction. It was the and I think New Jack had his place too. What a phenomenal talent Jerome. I mean, one of the most underrated talent in the history of ECW is New Jack because he was one of he's one of the most phenomenal communicators I've ever met. That man could get on that mic and make you hate him or love him in an instant. And and on television, hey, Jack, man. Sell this match. Alright, man. I'll sell this match. Now he did it in his own way, but, man, he could sell and and and and and, you know, and his matches served a purpose. You know? That that was your bloodletting. So, you know, if I had a more well rounded crew To put it mildly. Yeah. Yeah. But but but still, it served its purpose. You know? You know? By the time we got past 1999, the crew was so depleted, I had to rely on profanity and violence because that's the crew I had left because anybody else that had something to offer the more mainstream WWE or WCW was gonna go for the 1,000,000 of dollars, and I don't blame them for it. Now you've always got a good promo seemingly forever. Was there ever a time in your life that you, didn't have the gift for Gab? Because the point I'm trying to make is before some of those matches, before some of those pay per views, I mean, you fired up the crew. You cut about a 10 or 15 minute promo. It was y'all against the world. And those guys went out there and did anything and everything to further that cause. Had they bought into the system well, obviously, they did buy into the system. But, I mean, talk to me about those promos because, I mean, you let those guys up and they would run through a wall. Well, you know, they used to call it the Kool Aid. You know? I I everybody would drink the Kool Aid because, you know, I would don't stand it. I yeah. I would fire them up and, you know, and as you said, you know, they they they they would run themselves through a wall. They would walk through fire for, you know, for me or for the company or for the cause. And I think it's because I believed in the cause. I mean, that wasn't a gimmick that I was playing. It wasn't a manipulation of the wrestlers that, you know, I'm gonna motivate these guys. Here's what I'm going to do today. Yeah. I'm going to motivate my talent by saying, let's go and let's make this happen. Let's show these guys the ones who didn't hire you, the WWE that didn't have a vision for you, the WCW that's paying other people 200 $50,000 signing bonuses to jump, and they're not giving it to you guys. Let's go show them how stupid they are not to notice you as individuals. Yes. That's exactly what I shall do. I shall give them that persona and light up my locker room. I believed it. I first of all, I believed in my crew. There was nobody on that roster that I didn't truly believe in for the spot that they had. I truly believe The Sandman is one of the greatest characters we've ever stumbled upon. Do I think he's a great worker in the ring? Absolutely not. He's the drizzling and probably one of the worst workers of all time. But he was a money draw. Why? Because when that music played and he did that entrance, that audience was engaged, and they were with him. They were all as one, and it was part of an experience of the 2 and a half to 4 hours that we gave you a show. Same with New Jack. Same with Rob Van Dam. Same with Shane Douglas, Steve Austin, Mick Foley, Terry Funk, Tommy Dreamer, Joey Styles. From top to bottom, if you were there, I believed in you for a certain position. So the person that probably drank the most Kool Aid in that locker room was me. Because whether I should have bought into it as a businessman or not, as a producer, director, writer, as a booker, as, as a cult leader because it was in many ways a cult. And then probably the most passionate member of the cult was me. I believed in it. I believed in the cause, and I so believed in the talent that I worked with that when I fired them up, it was because I was their biggest fan. When you tried to, or not oh, no. When you tried to when you guys would take the show because y'all produces in your house. Right? And well basement. The the the, if you remember the cameraman, Ron Buffone. Yeah. Ron Buffone was partners with a guy named Charles Briseis. And Ron Buffone's parents had a house in pretty close to mine in Westchester County in New York. And Ron had converted his basement into a studio and converted a side room into the postproduction facility. Now, you know, the funniest thing is even to this day, people always say, hey. ECW was produced in a basement, and that was produced in somebody's mom's house. That's what I heard. Well, but here's the thing. Jay z and Beyonce. Mhmm. I mean, for you know, the the first couple of of have hip hop. Right. Jay z is a $400,000,000 man. He owned part of the Barclays Center. He owned part of the Brooklyn Nets. He has his own clothing line. He has this. He has that. Where does he produce his music now? In his own home. He converted his he bought a $10,000,000 home in Scarsdale, by the way. Changed the basement into a studio. Where does doctor Dre produce his music? In his own home. Do you really think Eminem goes down Melrose Boulevard to a studio that Jimmy Iovine picks out for him? No. Eminem bought himself a huge estate. First thing he built in his house, a production studio. So I'm not saying we had a multimillion dollar production studio. But if we're gonna talk about being cutting edge and being the first of many, hey. We put it in the basement because we had the access to a basement, and we put it in a side room because that's where we edited the show. No. I know. But that that was my point. But to to to go on that point, I mean, I do a little podcast. I don't like to leave my my house. So if I can record myself at my house, I do. And with you just laying down 3 extreme cases of studios at a house, I'm fixing to build myself a studio at 316 Elementary. It's gonna be the cat's a*s. And inspired here by conversation with Paul Heyman going back to that to that, basement, putting that show together. Your vision for the music Mhmm. Or or the not vision, but, your ear for the music because I'm going back and I'm thinking, you know, like, Thunder Kiss 65. I'm thinking Rob Zombie, the 9. I don't know. Now what was that song? I, oh my god. I I was gonna be kidding. Yeah. But right. You know? But just the music, the vibe, the energy, that that show because, man, when I watch the show, I was hooked. I love it. Funny. I I almost said Issey Miyake, and that's the cologne that I'm wearing. It wasn't Izay Miyake, and I really should know the name. You know what? The thing about it, I'm glad you're not wearing too much cologne. That's one of my pet peeves on the show. People wear too much cologne. You know? I read your tweet from the Delta Lounge. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. That was true. You're good Because you're not offensive over here. Because it it so it's a perfect level. But, so, I mean, what were you thinking to go back to the music, the vibe, and the energy of that show? Because, man, when I started watching ECW, you know, first, you know, eastern and then you got involved extreme, and it was just man, it it hits you. You felt it. And you didn't just watch it, but you felt it. And it was energy from top to bottom. So what were you thinking there? Well, I was frustrated because I I I I'd been fired from WCW, and then I sued them, and I got I I got a nice, large settlement, and I was actually out of the business. I I I, I was signed by the William Morris Agency in New York, an agent by the name of Jonathan Trumper. And they had a vision of going head to head with Howard Stern, who was, at the time, the end all be all. And, there was a hip hop station in New York called Hot 97. And Hot 97 had made the commitment, we're gonna go up against Howard Stern. So here's a smart a*s Jewish kid from Scarsdale, New York, and I was going to go head to head with Howard Stern starting that September. And, I mean, the deal was cut. It was here here we were going. I was out of the business. You know? It's funny that I say this now because it's 20 years later. Right. But I was 21 now. I was I was burned out. I wanted out, and I had my fill, and I was done. I played poly dangerously. I had a blast. Time to move on and do something else. And I'm on the phone with Jim Crockett, whose contract was expiring. His noncompete was expiring with WCW. And he said, so, what are you gonna do now? And I said, I'm gonna do radio. I'm gonna get involved in something else. You know? And and he said, don't don't you think the business needs a change? I said, yes. And I start rattling off, and I think we need to be more contemporary. These guys don't even know what hip hop is. They have no they have no sensation of of of of of what the audience is looking for today. I think you need more reality based programming. I think you need characters that are more based on the actual and I I start running off what ended up being the ECW vision. And Crockett says, so you're just gonna be one of these guys that b***h and moan and complain about it, and you're not gonna do anything to change the system because you can't change the system from the outside. You can only change it from the inside. He says, you know what? Maybe you should leave the business. The business has has enough locker room lawyers as it is. Thank you, mister Luger. I appreciate your contributions. You sound just like Abdul the Butcher. b***h, b***h, b***h, moan, moan, moan, moan, but you won't do anything about it. And he hung up on me. Straight up. I just shoot. Click. Right? Jim Crockett junior of all people. I mean, really And he cut that promo on you. b***h slapped me. Right. b***h slapped me. I'm like, wow. And I'm walking around all pissed off all day. Like, oh, yeah. I would call him back and tell him he's right. He's right. I won't do anything. I'm just like everybody else, b***h. I'm just a locker room lawyer. Why don't I do something about it? End of fun. And Joey Stiles tells this story better than I do because I told it to him back in the day. And I, you know, I I I had too much I smoked way too much pot in the 19 nineties to really remember these stories accurately. But, anyway, I, that day, I was watching MTV. And the first video that came on after Beavis and Butthead, because I was a huge Beavis and Butthead fan, because I was stoned, was LL Cool J's mama said knock you out. Right. And I watched it and the angles and the way that they shot him in the in the fogged out arena with the with the old school microphone that dropped down like in the 1st Rocky movie or like in the Madison Square Garden days back when superstar Billy Graham was champion. And I just said, man, that's the vision. It doesn't have to just be matches, you know, to get and now here's your next enhancement match. You can put anything you want on the air. If you cut it and you make it stylistic and you give it an edge and you give it a beat, that there's something that you can't take your eyes off. Because no matter how many times they reaired that video that day, I watch it from beginning to end with my jaw open. I just I was like, wow. There's something fascinating about this. And I called Jim Crockett back, and I said, I'm in. And he wanted to start what we were gonna call the World Wrestling Network. Now at the same time, I had to now disassociate myself with the deal from hot 97 and piss off the William Morris Agency. And now I'm saying, you know what? I'm gonna go, and I'm gonna change the industry. Eddie Gilbert But so you were gonna get into radio broadcasting. Yes. And you were gonna go head to head with Howard Stern. I was out of the way. And you just said piss on it. I'm not gonna do that. I'm getting back in the wrestling game. And Jim Crockett talked me into it by by by by b***h slapping me on the phone back. God. But what you know, what could have happened? Do you ever think about that had you done the radio thing? See, I you know, it's funny. My father taught me a long time ago. If your aunt had balls, she'd be your uncle. But she doesn't have balls, so she's not your uncle. So call her aunt Roseanne. So don't even worry about what could have been. I never deal with ifs. I you know, because if we're gonna deal with ifs But I'm just talking because I know he is a bright, sharp minded guy with a quick, you know, wit and talk a mile a minute and make sense. Right. So I just think, yeah, you would have been damn good on here. Oh, I'd have kicked Howard Stern's a*s Yeah. And probably, you know, ended up with his deal on Sirius satellite radio with a $100,000,000,000. And here I am doing WrestleMania 30 sitting up in your hotel my room. The Steve Austin podcast, which will now be broadcast from now on from your basement like Jay z and Beyonce and like the old ECW TV shows. Hallelujah. So back in the wrestling business. So I was back in, you know, and then Eddie Gilbert was in Philadelphia. And back then, Eddie Gilbert and I were thick as thieves. We know that he he was my brother. He was he was my mentor. He was my he was my best friend. And, he was in Philadelphia running Eastern championship wrestling with Todd Gordon, but it was falling apart because this was not the same Eddie that had contributed so much to the business. Right. This was this was the end of the line for Eddie, and and and he had lost himself in the narcotics that had taken over his life. So it was falling apart for Eddie bad, and Todd was desperate for somebody. Was he that bad? Awful. Awful. Yeah. Awful. It wasn't him anymore. Yeah. A different human being. I mean, if you look at the creativity, I mean, we we were in Alabama together in 1988 before I went to WCW, and we had a skeleton crew. And he was so magnificent as a booker. You know? I mean, we we worked well together, but, clearly, I was his deputy. I was his assistant. I was his protege. Clearly, he knew what he was doing. He could find so much in in in in so little. And yet if he had a real good talent, oh, what he could do with them. And and he popped that territory. I mean, truly popped that territory and fast And that would have been continental? Lasting. Yeah. Continental. I mean, he popped it fast, and it lasted the entire summer. Right. And and it was just brilliant, the stuff that he was coming up. Now most of it, admittedly, was stuff that he watched that Lawlor and Jarrett had booked in Memphis years before, but he put a new spin on it. I mean Right. Just as an example, because I'm a big believer in this. You know, so many people talk about one of their favorite ECW angles of all time was the Sandman angle when we blinded him, and he stayed in his house for 4 weeks. And we've said, you know, he's gone. He's retiring, and he came out. And, of course, he revealed he wasn't really blind, and he beat the living dog crap out of Tommy Dreamer. Okay. And and everybody you know? And it's funny because, you know, this is one of your oh, what a genius thing, Paul Ball. Did you see how Haman booked that? Okay. Here's why it's not that much genius. Do you remember the old southern angle where a guy would come out with broken arm? I broke my arm last night in Oakenfield, Kentucky, and I can't I can't wrestle Jerry Lawler or Bill Dundee or Robert Fuller, whatever the baby face was. And my arm is broken. My I'm gonna get you next week when this cast comes off my arm. And, of course, the baby face comes down and goes, well, I'll fight your man whoever you're old. Here's my man right now. And it'd be, you know, some big fat 400 pound guy behind him. And when the baby face turns around, out comes the arm. Well, bam. Down goes the baby face. Right? And you gave it away in 5 minutes of television. Right. Same thing that we did with the Sandman. We, quote, unquote, blinded him. He played blind, but we didn't do it for one day. We didn't do it for 5 minutes. We did it for 4 or 5 weeks, and we milked it out to where it got the most possible impact. It was just an updated version of one of the oldest angles in the business. This is the Steve Austin Show. Hey. I wanna tell you guys about Cushy Dreams. Cushy Dreams offers a full lineup of premium smokeable CBD. They specialize in extraordinary CBD rich hemp flower, AKA bud, and cans and pre roll CBD joints. Enjoy all of the health benefits of CBD without getting high under 0.3 THC. It's cannabis that ships directly to you, and it's legal in all 50 states. 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Bet online is the world's most trusted betting platform and your number one source for online betting from the earliest odds to in game live betting. BetOnline provides you with all the action and the ability to watch and bet on games as they happen with the largest selection of odds on everything from football, NBA, college basketball as well. BetOnline has NHL, MMA, and championship boxing, all your betting needs in one place. Head to BetOnline today to get in on the action with America's most trusted site for online wagering. So have some fun. Make these games and these events and these combat sports a little more interesting with BetOnline. BetOnline, the game starts here. The Steve Austin Show. The Steve Austin Show. Called dangerously. Paul Heyman. It's Paul Dangerously. But you grew up your whole life in New York. Yes. So how when you all of a sudden, you got the wrestling bug. No. You you were taking pictures. Yes. You're a photographer. But how'd you end end up getting your first managing gig down there in the south? Well, I actually started in the northeast, and Kevin Sullivan had come up for a show. And, you know, it's it's not it's not what you know. It's who you know. Right. And I knew Kevin from when I was a photographer because I had put him and Nancy on the cover of a few wrestling magazines. And so Kevin knew me. And the funny thing was the month before I started as a manager, I was actually down in Florida taking pictures for all the magazines. And I was joking around with Humperdinck, and Humperdinck going, brother, brother, you should do this on television, brother. I'm like, no. How do I do this on television? I really had no ambition to actually perform. Come on. I really I I I I didn't because I didn't really think I could have done it. I really you know, to make it, you have to make it to Madison's you know, to me, the end all be all would be the Madison. What was it what was it about the business that you, just last on to from your earliest memories? The larger than life personalities. Once I saw superstar Billy Graham on television that first time talking about Bruno Sammartino and the spag you know, I'm gonna come on there. I'm gonna take the spaghetti. I'm gonna take the spaghetti because I won't just take the food off the man's plate. I'm gonna take the spaghetti off the man's plate. I'm gonna wrap it around my 22 inch biceps so that the vascularity comes out on the superstar on the microwave system beamed across the galaxy where they all can they just admire the superstar, and I just went, I wanna be him. I wanna talk for a living. I don't wanna punch a clock. I wanna go on TV and just talks. Yeah. And that was it. I I was like, my god. This is just the larger than life personalities that just could come through the TV set. So then you're talking with Humber Dick. He says you gotta get in. You you do what? I I I I didn't believe And you got hooked up with Kevin? Well, what happened was I I was taking pictures at the Monster Factory, Larry Sharp's school that that that he actually inherited from from Buddy Rogers. And, 1 I had already promoted a few events. I promoted Bam Bam Bigelow's first match in 1985 when I was 19 years old at Studio 54. So, I mean, I'd been in and I also wrote a bunch of the TV shows behind the scenes for a lot of the north because back you know, I understand 1985 was when WrestleMania debuted, and this was the explosion of cable in country. So there were every single town. No. Cox cable would have its own stations in different towns. So San Antonio would have Cox cable 10, and then Austin would have Cox cable 12. These are all different TV stations, and they're not just local access. These are actual TV stations because it's now cable is expanding. One of them, channel 17 out of Atlanta, became a superstation, which became everybody's goal. There were 20 to 25 promotions in the northeast in 1985. So I was doing play by play for half of them, and I was god awful because I had no idea what I was doing yet. But I was also writing some of their TV shows because I would write their programs and say, listen. I'll tell you what. I'll let you sell the programs. You can even keep the money if you cover my cost. But can I write this TV show? Because I like to do that. I like to play around with the personalities. So I'd already had experience writing the TV shows, and Bigelow had already gone to Memphis and Texas, and he'd already started touring. And he already had I I don't know if he had a Japan tour yet, but I think he had at least one. And, Studio 54 had had folded because of the big insurance crisis in 1986. And I was out of work except for the wrestling magazines, and I was looking for something else to do. And Bigelow said, hey, man. Why don't dude, you know, you should just talk your on television. I was like, man. I I could never do that. You know, you gotta you gotta play the if you're gonna be anybody, you gotta be like, you would say, if you're not here to win the title, you're just spinning your wheels, maybe wasting your time. If I wasn't gonna make it to the garden, if I wasn't gonna be the the heir apparent to Fred Glassey and Lou Albano in the grand wizard, I didn't wanna do it. I wanted to be the biggest one in the business or not be the not be the guy at all. Right. But I also had a desire to write and produce and direct, which, you know, they call booking back then. Man, I really wanted to be a booker, but there was no way I was gonna ever get to be a booker if I didn't get in the door. And I figured a way in the door was to be this polydangerously schmuck, talk on television, get in with the promoters, and go, hey. Could I write your TV show? So I took them up on it. So I started doing it in the northeast. And unlike my 2nd or 3rd show, Kevin Sullivan was there. So when so when we're doing this this interview, I'm I'm with my guys, the Motor City men men who were 2 students from Larry Sharp's school, and and and I did an interview. And because Kevin was there, I decided I threw in a couple of references to some guys from the past that he would identify with, like Black Jack Mulligan and Dusty Rhodes and and Ric Flair and, you know, and the Asiatic Spike and Mark Lewin. And by the time I was on, he goes, brother, would you like to do this in Florida? And I, absolutely, I'd like to do this in Florida. And by the way, who writes your TV show? You know? So the next thing you know, I was booked in Florida. So how'd you come up with the name Paulie Dangerously? I when I was younger and skinnier and, and had some hair, I looked like Michael Keaton, who had done a movie called Johnny Dangerously. Yeah. And I just I liked the name. I just thought, okay. What what name can you use? Cause who would ever remember the name Paul Heyman? I can't go out there and say, ladies and gentlemen, my name is Paul Heyman. How could that ever get over? So I was just looking for, you know, it was the, it was the age of gimmicky names too. And I was looking for a name and I just I I was so much I looked so much like Michael Keaton back then. I just said, you know what? Paulie Dangerously. And it was a catchy little name that, you know, it was a, you know, and it was a schmucky name too. So that's Wait. You know that, but that that's that's the that's the, that's the line in the sand. It's either schmucky because it doesn't get over or it's really cool if it does get over. It's it's it's gonna be it it is what it is. It's just if you get it over or not. You know, if if I never if I never accomplish anything else in this industry, I can honestly go around and say to myself, I'm the guy that got stone called Steve Austin to use the word schmucky. Schmucky. I know you know you're gonna get a call from Jim Rutt. Did you actually go on air and say schmucky with Hayman? So, the the the telephone, the big ass, goofy cell phone, the idea for that. Freddie Blassie used to have a cane. Right. And, when I used to ride with Freddie Blassie when I was 15 years old, he always just say, get it get a prop, kid. Get a gimmick. Hit somebody over the head with it, and you'll make a ton of money. The pencil make geeks, they never saw it coming. So, you know, so I broke in, and I realized there's nobody that's doing something that taps into the modern day. Everybody most of the managers that I saw were doing things that were hearkening back to the then the sixties seventies, and I was already in the late eighties. And the movie Wall Street was very popular, and Gordon Gekko had that big cell phone. Yep. And I remember saying, you know, you take a cell phone like that to crack somebody over the head. It's a great way to get heat or you get color or it's the finish of the match. Or it also looks like a hotshot thing to have because no one had one. Exactly. So it fit the Wall Street yuppie character, and it was so obnoxious to walk around with his big phone in the middle of the match. And I'm, who is he talking to? Who they they they're not really talking to anybody. Hey. Screw you. So it was a heat getter, and it was a weapon. Okay. So when you look back at at at all the greatest managers, who in your mind do you really still look up to? Because I would put you in among the top of all time without everything that now that you've accomplished. So you're up there. Well, thank you. You've you've done or or, in my mind, accomplished, an an astronomical, amount, in your career. But in your mind, who are the greatest managers of all time? I mean, I I don't think you can have that conversation without Bobby Heenan. Oh, Bobby's Jesus Christ. I mean, that guy could work his a*s. I mean, he could work better than most of the boys. Yes. Timing, impeccable. Just incredible. And could fill any role. Any role where you can love him, you can hate him, you can make you laugh. And as soon as you got finished, make you laugh, make you hate him again. The stuff that he did back and forth with Gorilla was just absolutely priceless. Amazing. It's just an amazing talent. And and and and it's a shame that Bobby Heenan never did something outside of the industry like Saturday night live Oh. Because he was so qualified Oh, yeah. For something like that. Yeah. I was a big fan of Lou Albano, in in terms of someone who could generate a lot of heat. And I don't mean to speak ill of somebody, especially if they're gone, but if you watch what he did when then the baby faces got their hands on him, I kinda resent it now. Because I know the beating that I take Right. When it's time for the baby face to blow it off. I mean, just what punk and I did last year and just the you know, with with the Kendo stick, he beat the living crap out of me every single night and and needed to. And the people needed to see that I was Yeah. Legitimately getting my a*s kicked because that's what they paid to see. Right. And Albano would just, like, the the other famous match that he had with Snooker in the garden. And and and, please, anybody watching this, go on YouTube and YouTube Lou Albano, comma, Jimmy Snooker, comma, Madison Square Garden. And I'm sure the WWE Warriors will have this taken down, so do it fast. Snooker comes in the ring. He hits Albino who just shakes, literally takes the tape off his wrist, takes the blade, runs it across his forehead as blatant as if you know, the old Memphis thing where, you know, you hold open your tights and you put your hand down your pants. You get a chain up. You know what I mean? Logic. Yeah. You wrap the chain around your hand so that the guy in the highest cheap seat can see it. Yeah. That's what he did with the blade. Yeah. And then he feeds back to snooker who hits him, hits him, hits him, hits him, hits him, hits him, hits him, and Obama just goes, and then he takes out the blade again and just goes and zippers himself and takes 2 bumps in the match and then takes a splash and rolls out and does the Albana walk back to the dressing room. Again, you ask me who the best is. I think Albana was great at what he does, what he did. The the heat that he drew was just amazing to me back in the day. I wish he would have put the baby faces over more when it was time because when Bobby Heen put the baby faces over forget about it. My god. That man could take an a*s. Could take an a*s for me, egg on his face. He could be embarrassed, humiliated, and and and he he gave it all back. So, you know, I I look at those 2, you know, just as being the best of all time. I mean, there are certainly I mean, I I listen. I think JJ Dillon played his role fantastically. Yeah. Yeah. I didn't like JJ when I worked in WCW because I realized how hard I was working compared to how hard he was working. But now that I'm older Yeah. And I just stand at the desk, and then I I raise an eyebrow or I just take one step. Oh, Heyman has moved one step closer to the ring. I kind of appreciate what the old man was doing. Cornett was great. Yeah. And great to work with too. Yeah. I always got me about Jim Cornett was I mean, one of my favorites of all time, and, of course, Midnight Express, one of my favorite tag teams of all time. But Jesus Christ, he could run his mouth for for 20, 30 minutes just nonstop. I mean, forget about it and forever. Well, he was a courtesy of Jimmy Hart. Yeah. And that's another great Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. You know? Again, but these are all managers of difference. I'm not saying that these are the styles that I could never do what Jimmy Hart did. I could never do what Jim Cornette did. I couldn't take bumps like Bobby Heenan could take. I can I can get my a*s kicked pretty well Yeah? But I have to legitimately get my a*s kicked to do it. You know, and and Lou Albano was Lou Albano, and, you know, and and I I I would be remiss not to say Freddie Blassie because my god, he knew box office. Freddie understood, you know, the key lines to say on the go home week. And Ernie Roth, the grand wizard, was probably one of the most brilliant strategic managers. And I mean by giving you know, I want you to go in the ring and and hit him with a left and a right. And I I don't mean that. I mean, just strategic in terms of of of of his interviews and hitting the key selling points the right weeks to sell the tickets. And he was brilliant. I learned a lot from him too. How was he just a as a guy behind the stage? I mean, because I just saw I knew of the grand wizard watching him with the superstar. Very interesting because everything he he he had a booker's mentality. So everything was about how to book something. It was never about, hey. This guy needs to do this or this guy needs to that. I you know, the the it was always about the long wait. What's the vision for this guy? Where are they going with him? You know, if you put too much sympathy on this guy, then when the time comes and you really need to beat him down, you've is it they've already seen him sell. Or, you know you know you know what? That heel is peaking too quickly, and they're gonna wanna blow the steam off of him now instead of letting him build for 6 or 7 months and then giving him to Backlund or whomever was the or, you know, sergeant Slaughter or Jimmy Snooker or or or or Pat Patterson at the time. So he always had a booker's mentality. Where where's not only today's box office? What's the long range box office? Because he worked for the Sheik. Right. And there's a guy that had more longevity than almost anybody in the territory. So you always and and, you know, and you look at Dashiek and Bobo Brazil and Pam Pero Ferpo and the guys that drew money long time in Detroit, and that's that's how Ernie learned it. So when Ernie was teaching somebody, he was teaching you not just quick fixes and momentary business. What's the long range vision here? Anybody else? I gotta put Paul Elleringue in there. I thought he was a perfect fit with, with the road warriors. I liked what he did. And and then going back to your point about JJ Dillon, I thought he was perfect, you know, with with the 4 horsemen. I can't deny that. I mean, I you know, whether they stand out as my favorites, I can't say that they No. No. No. No. Yeah. Yeah. You know, it's favorites. But, I mean, I under listen. They were very good in their roles Yeah. And and they certainly played it very well. I mean, but you can say the same thing about a lot. I mean, there was her all the company. There was her Dudley Clements. There was Eddie Creechman. I mean, all the all these guys, there was, you know, back in the day with with with Buddy Roger, who looked better than than Bobby Davis as a manager? I mean, my god. Do you know that the guy was the perfect manager with with Buddy Rogers? They were guys that filled that role, but Bobby Heenan could work with anybody. Oh, absolutely. I, yeah, I I I put Bobby Heenan probably as number 1. Promos. You just did a great superstar Billy Graham on the go. Super superstar was ahead of his time. Yes. Dusty Rhodes, I loved his promos. Who who's some of your favorite promo guests? Back in the those days or just of all time? Any day. He's gonna sound like I'm kissing your ass, but, obviously, Stone Cold Steve Austin. Ravishing Rick Rude be and and and the funniest thing was I never liked this promos on television, but I love them live. I always thought that Rude was a live event promo guy and never truly mastered the art of doing promos on television because he was so big, and he and and and and and he broadcasted so wide Right. That he was a live event guy more than he was a television guy. I like Jake Roberts' promos as a heel Right. Very much so. Having worked with him since I've been back, I love Centimeters Punk's promos. Yep. I I don't think you can ever list best promo guys and not mention The Rock. Right. I don't think you can mention best promo guys and not mention Vince McMahon during his run with you. Right. Those were some killer promos that drew all the heat that your you as a babyface needed to rebel against. Right. He wasn't my style, but Hogan drew a lot of money talking. Oh, absolutely. No doubt about that. I mean, people bought into that act of hook, line, and sinker. If I asked you today who the greatest in ring worker was of all time, I think you'd tell me Ric Flair. Well, I mean, he's my he's my favorite, pro wrestler. You know, when I when I look at, just straight up performers, Shawn Michaels. I think Shawn Michaels was a far more well rounded, bigger box office, better in ring worker than Ric Flair, but my god Yeah. Ric Flair would talk and make you believe he was, you know, the best that he's going to be. I mean, yo, and he was he was he was the whole thing, and it was 247365 with that guy. And Shawn Michaels, the the thing, his favorite pro wrestler is Ric Flair as well. So I'm in good company. Yes. But when I look at the the best in ring performer night in, night out just on athleticism, stories, psychology, the whole ball of wax, Shawn Michaels is to to me is number 1. See, and it's funny. I'll well, actually, you know, and and I think there's something else. And and and, I I I don't think Jerry Lawler ever gets enough credit Never. For the money that he drew in Memphis and how he talked them into the building. And and you gotta include him on your all time promo list just because, I mean, he could tell a story. I mean, all you gotta do is just Lance Russell hand him a damn microphone or just lead him in. He doesn't even have to lead him in. He'll start telling a story. And then what I always loved about Lawler's work, whether it's either promo or in the ring, with intensity. You know, a lot of guys think, okay, man. We've been feuding like a sum, b***h, for all this long. We just gotta jump it. Lawler could still just go out there and lock up with the guy and tell the story from from jump street and not, you know, from from from a and then end up at z by the end of the match. Yes. In a rage, pulling the strap down, double color, you know, and it was a blow off. You didn't have to start, you know, at 6,000 RPMs. And he did that whether he was talking or whether he was working. And that's why I have so much respect, for Jared the king Lawler. Yes. He was one of the best promos that people think it's because he wasn't running his mouth a mile a minute or saying catch phrases that they didn't you know, maybe didn't catch, onto what he was doing, but make no bones about it. Lawler is one of my favorites of all time, talking or working. Tell you somebody else was Austin Idol. I was watching a lot of Austin Idol the other day because I know we used to ride together. Yes. And, you know, Rude was in the car, and I'd be saying GD too much, and he'd get mad. Or, Steve, must you use a large name in vain while he's rolling the joint back here? But I was watching some, some, Austin Idol the other day try to dig into some of this stuff. Sometimes I wanted his cadence to speed up a little bit for me, but he was very deliberate and articulate in what he said and and had a certain confidence level. Managed him in Memphis when I was 21 years old. Right. And I you know, just the way, brother. You know? You would come on the and he would scream and he'd yell. And, I mean, he would he would yell at the top of his lungs, but he would enunciate the words. Because most guys that yell and I'm I was very guilty of this in in my younger days. When you yell, people can't understand everything that you're saying because you're yelling. You're and you had the tendency, like, you're yelling. You're talking so fast. And you're talking so fast that that that you that they lose the meaning of the words that you're saying. Right. And because you're emphasizing every words, none of them really stick out. Right. The genius of Austin Idol was that he could yell and still hit the points, articulate, and and, enunciate the words to such a degree that you understood everything that he was saying. I was fast I I was fascinated. When I I would work with him, we would do promos, and I'd catch myself staring at him just because I couldn't believe it. I was like, wow. This guy's really good. I hope I'm this good one day. You know? And you catch yourself doing it. This is the Steve Austin Show. You own or rent your home? Sure you do. And I bet it can be hard work. You know what's easy? Bundling policies with GEICO. GEICO makes it easy to bundle your homeowners or renters insurance along with your auto policy. It's a good thing too because you already have so much to do around your home. Go to GEICO.com. Get a quote and see how much you could save. It's GEICO easy. Visitgeico.com today. That's geico.com. Favorite matches about time. Oh, by the way, you know, and I and I and I and I'm happy to answer that. I'll tell you something, and this is gonna sound like hype. But I have to give somebody credit for, I think, being one of the best all time in ring workers, but he's never, more than 2 years of his life, never worked a full schedule. Who's that? Brock Lesnar. Tell me somebody more believable than his work. Nobody. Right. Yeah. Right. The man is a may and, again, I know this is gonna sound oh, of course, he's gonna say, Brock. 1, oh, it's his buddy or 2. He works with Brock Lesnar, and he's hyping his own guy. I mean this sincerely. I've always thought this about Brock. Man, 6 3. He's £295, and sometimes he's over £300. Yeah. He can do anything he wants in the ring. His selling is amazing. His offense is quite believable, and everything he does looks right for him. He's not one of these big muscle guys that stand in the ring and you have to bounce off. He can bounce off of you. Yeah. And what he does looks credible. So and just and and he and he understands his character, and he understands what he should and shouldn't do. So just in terms of being an all around in ring performer, I'm always captivated by watching him. And I don't just say that because Here's the thing. Let me cut you off. I don't even think the guy scratched the surface yet because I would I'm I'm a big Brock Lesnar fan. I knew when he walked in the door, I just did a deal for UFC fight pass a couple of days ago. They're doing a special on Brock. And I'm I remember when Brock walked in, it's just like I said on the interview. It's like, you might as well have a bolt on each side of his neck. But just just Frankenstein of a human being walks in the door, and all of a sudden everybody goes, this dude over there, you know, they everybody knew he was gonna be something. And that doesn't usually happen because everybody knew that he had a division 1 or whatever background, all American. So he knew he could go. And then all of a sudden you see this look, you can't just manufacture that look. You're you're born with it. Right. And, you know, the dude is just bada*s. And so he's got all these skills, and all of a sudden, you know, he learned the pro game, you know, from his amateur background, and then, you know, maybe the travel schedule, whatever, a little hectic. He, you know, goes to play football. Had Brock Lesnar, started off with the background of football and and had technique, he'd he'd be playing in pro in NFL right now. But he's going against guys who played football all their lives and had leverage on him. Well, also, when he went to the Vikings camp Yeah. He was the last guy to get cut. And when he got cut, he had that motorcycle accident. He actually did that entire camp with a broken jaw and broke and a broken pelvis. Yeah. I didn't know that. And Because he doesn't give excuses. Yeah. He's not an excuses type of guy. Oh, no. I mean, he's a freak of nature. And I mean, that was that's about a good a compliment as I can give anybody. So anyway, so then he goes to UFC, lean leaning on his amateur wrestling background and not really a technically proficient striker. And and what does he do? Turns into the world heavyweight champion in an octagon, and and beat some of the baddest cats in the program at the time. Including Randy Couture, who's arguably the greatest heavyweight of all. Frank Mir, one of the greatest, heavyweight submission, guys in the game. And and then, you know, his issues with diverticulitis. I mean, who knows, you know, how he would've really performed if he had to have those issues going against him. Now he comes back to the squared circle. And so, really, he's still he's still a young guy in life because he's probably 34, 35. Years in the business, he's still actually still a young guy because he's got so much more. I mean, however long he wants to wrestle, he will because that's the type of physical specimen that he is. I don't think that we've seen the best of Brock Lesnar yet. I don't. I agree with you. I agree with you. And I'm I'm glad someone feels that way. It doesn't seem to think I'm flapping my gums about my friend or the guy that I'm I'm paired with. So, I mean but if if he were to get on a full time schedule and I don't know what his deal is. Well, that ain't gonna happen. Well, I know. But, I mean, I was we were we were texting each other because I'm looking forward to seeing when he comes in a couple days. But, I mean, were he to just get on the road and and go full tilt, who knows what you would see out the guy? I I just think he would just redefine what what is going on in the squared circle right now. And it because he's a he's a dominant, specimen. He he understands the game. And if if if he had you you know the you know the deal, Paul. Let me quit stuttering. Everything is on the job training, and you get into a rhythm. I want you to get into that rhythm, and all of a sudden, all the creative juices start flowing. And it's just not a gig here, there, and, you know, and wherever on a on a, you know, yearly contract. There's no telling what the guy could do if he got on the road. I I think he's he's in the mode now of the super fight. And I think And that's a great mode to be in. Let me let I'm just saying what could be if he were to get on the road before I, you know, let you talk again. Yeah, man. The way he's booked right now, he's got that's a catch meow. Yes. I love his gig. It's a great gig and, you know, and and and not to put you on the spot, but can you imagine the baddest dude on the planet versus the toughest SOB in WWE history? Because I mean, when we were in UFC and we were always thinking, do you think we're ever gonna go back to WWE? I mean, ever. You know? To me, that you know? And when you came to his match, which was the was was the match with a Carwin. Right. You know? That and I even said it to you then. I was like, man, that that that's just the ticket. You know? I mean, just to me, I don't know who could tempt you to ever come back. I don't you know? I I really don't. I because not only does it have to be the right box office. It has to be the right opponent. It has to be the right creative. It has to be someone that can push you physically to deliver the same type of performance that people remember you giving them in the late 19 nineties when you were absolutely untouchable inside the ring. So it has to be someone that can give you that match, have to be someone that could give you the right venom for your promos, has to be the right creative, has to be the has to be the right physicality, and, obviously, has to be the right box office. To me, I look at, okay, who would Steve Austin come back against? The one guy that I look at is Brock Lesnar. And I say that from a selfish basis knowing that some point in that push, I'd be eating a stunner and be covered in beer that you would douse me with as you're saying, I got your b***h right here. Come and get him and pick him up. And no doubt a bunch of knuckle sandwiches. Oh, I'm sure there would be. Hey, before we wrap this whole thing up. I like how you completely changed the subject. I'm now. No. Well, that's a conversation Vince and I need to have one day and but watch. I'll push the stop button and then I'll push over the restart button again. Okay. We're recording again. That that could happen. So that that that would be, how I could accomplish that. Your honor, may we go off the record? So that that that would be something that I'd be inter inter interested in, entertaining. But, anyway, so now here we are. Oh, you just sold this podcast. Austin admits he's tempted by Lesnar. Well, you heard it here first on the Steve Austin show. I haven't had the blood of Mary yet. Hey. So is it is it is it Lesnar's move now to say, I wouldn't wanna fight that guy. He's doing podcasts. Well, it's another machine to promote the match. All hands on deck, Paul. All hands on deck. All screens, all platforms. Hey. Before we wrap this thing up, I got one bar of strength of, battle left on my meter. We had some damn good times traveling down the road with Ravish and Rick Rude. You know, one of the funniest things I I loved about traveling with you guys, we're just sitting around and talking about the business. And because you you know, when Rick Rude started talking, and as good of a mind as you have for the business, he was so clear in his vision and how he broke the business down. It was very a b c, and it it was very simple for him. Yes. And Yes. He loved booking, and he just loved talking about, you know, what we needed to do next or he needed to do do next or what the crowd was doing or he loved the he he loved playing chess or playing Yes. Checkers, whatever the game was. He simplified it. Yeah. You know, Rick Rick, how do you see this? I see it very simple. Black hat, white hat. What about it don't you see? Yeah. And that was it. Simplify the entire situation with that. There's a good guy. There's a bad guy. The bad guy has to has has to have enough heat that a credible good guy comes to kick his ass, and the people pay to see it. But but it was it was fun times. I had a blast. Man, we used to roll into, Kansas City. We always stay at the Marriott there, and we'd be playing pool. And I don't know what Rick was doing. I know he'd had a couple of beers. He wasn't so much of a heavy drinker, but there I was, and me and him always were partners. And, because we didn't need any animosity in the car. And there would be Rick standing there, and I'm I'm sitting here, and I've got this, you know, like, both hands vertically hanging on to the pool cue. And he'd be standing there, and that that pool cue would be, like, the 3rd pod, and so he would just be standing there asleep, standing up. And it'll be his shot. And I missed a shot, and the other person missed a shot. We was all drunk. And so I didn't have to go wake up Rick while he was standing here holding his pool cue. I was like, Rick, it's your shot. There you go. What what are you gonna do? A shot? One time, I think it was in Philly. It was a late night. I didn't have any money. Just came to WWF. I'm I'm hanging out with Rick Rude. And, was it WCW or Rick or WWF? Had to been WWF. That had to be WCW because that was the only time we were together. Probably. Okay. So we're WCW, late night, about 2, 3 in the morning. Me and Rick decided to split a room. All times we traveled together. You know, I always stayed by myself or Right. You you would stay at the we we'd stay at the Marriott, and you would always be at the motel 6. You go, Steve, you have to upgrade a little. And you're like, I'm just a simple man, Rick. I like a sonic hamburger. I like me a beer, and I like me my motel sick. They'll leave the light on for you. That one time, I spent the night with Rick Rude and and pretty hammered. And Rick was over snoring like a freight train. I mean, I cannot tell you how loud it was snoring. And I was over madder in a hornet because I can't I don't sleep very well. Anyway, and he'd be over the store. And I go, Rick. Rick. Yeah. He'd roll over. And 5 minutes later, he start over. Rick. Rick. You know, 5 and I'm getting madder and madder and madder, but what do you what are you gonna do? Wake up Rick Rude? I mean, he was a badass dude anyway. And he's a senior guy. He's a veteran in the business and just start going, dude, shut up. I cannot sleep. I'm the rookie in the room. I'm so glad to show him respect. So anyway, point is, I didn't sleep an ounce that night. And from that night on, I never roomed with another human being because I didn't wanna listen to a sum snore. But he could scale a catfish with the best of them, couldn't he? Oh, dude. Don't give me on that catfish story. Go ahead and tell it. Oh, I told the story the other day. You know, I was down there at the hunting camp in Georgia. He caught about 20 catfish. I caught about 2. I'm out there in a trash can with a pair of pliers, skinny catfish. Someone had brought a damn easy chair and a big screen I mean, a a color TV in one of those top load VHS players. He's in there smoking a big fat joint. Rick loved to smoke dope. I wish that guy was still around. He's so funny. And then all of a sudden, he walks out. Someone brought Kate Fear. He's in and watching Robert De Niro and Kate Fear, and he comes out. He goes the screen door slams. What are you doing? Rick, I'm cleaning all these catfish. I said, do you wanna help me clean them? Nope. It walks back in and sits on the easy chair and starts watching Cape Fear again. Man, a very few words. He always simplified the situation, and he articulated his answer perfectly. Hey, man. So many of the damn boys I don't wanna end this thing on a on a on a bad note. Man, so many damn guys have left this damn world, too soon. I I I reach out and everything. I'll call someone out of the blue check-in on how they're doing. It's just, it's a rough life, but guys gotta take care of themselves. Yes. Yes. The the the the travel in and of itself, the demands of the travel are are are just brutal. They will aid you so much. Yeah. I don't wanna get on a big tangent, but all you guys out there and the guys that got out of business, man, chill back on your stuff. It's time to go back into a civilian life. Hell, I did. I'm trying to live on this g*****n ball of rock, we call Earth, for as long as I can. Another 15, 20, 30 years would be good. Well, don't limit yourself. Wait a minute. Come on, man. I'm 49. Hang on. If I get 30 years, yeah, I'm I'm good. Okay. That'll be time to have to get the deal in real quick. I don't wanna check out that early. I'd like to hang I'd like to hang around a little longer. You're not gonna be the guy in a nursing home with a guy. You're like, okay, Paul. We're gonna mister Heyman, you know, because he's 20 or she's 20, we're gonna change your diaper. You know? Hey. What are we gonna do with pop? You know? My children sitting there. Could you put dad in the garage today? I have friends coming over. You know? They wheel me to the garage and, like, you know, that's what my kids will end up doing with me. What does pop wanna do today? Oh, he said he wanted to watch his e ECW DVD highlight reel again. I don't you know, it's funny because he asked me about the barbed wire city. I don't watch anything old. I really don't. Yeah. I don't I I I don't wax nostalgic. I just, you know, I I I learned that from a from a from being a kid. You know? My my mother was a was a holocaust survivor. So I mean, she I I you know, it was just it was always about moving forward into the future. You can't really hang on to the past. You can't live in the past. So I just, I I I my kids watch it. Right. But, you know, and and I I meant it sincerely. I tried to take away all the YouTube stuff that they they to watch just because I was like, that's not daddy anymore. You know? Let them watch now. And Yeah. And, I don't I I never watched the past. And, of course, they they tell you, no. I'm old and seen. I'll go, and it was me. And I there I am right there. Alright. We're gonna wrap up this, edition of Steve Austin Show. I rounded up Paul Lee, down there in the green room. He came up here. I don't have one single note. Didn't look in a computer. Called it and rang. Thank you for your time. Appreciate you going by the room. Yeah. That's my play. Can we get room service now? Man, that brings my interview with Paul Heyman to a close, folks. But get ready because part 2 is coming Thursday. Think about it was, hell, I pushed the stop button. It was time to stop the interview. Paul Lee just sat there. We kept talking and talking and talking. So I said, well, hey, man. What if we just fire up the record button and start recording again? So we did. We're gonna get to part 2 of my conversation with Paul e Dangerously, AKA Paul Heyman. This coming Thursday is great to sit down with an old friend. And, you know, again, just kinda call it in the ring. There's a lot of things that after I had the conversation with Paul, I wished I would have asked. But I didn't know who I was gonna come across because it was WrestleMania 30 weekend. And I didn't have I knew who I wanted to talk to, but didn't know if I was gonna get to talk to him. So I was gonna do a bunch of research prior to, going into the situation and not be able to get a hold of people I wanted to talk to. So believe me, all the people I talked to were great people. I just love to do my research to go get some more. Paul Heyman coming up this Thursday as a wrap up part 2. This has been a Podcast 1 production. Download new episodes of the Steve Austin show every Tuesday at podcastone.com. That's podcastone.com. A true crime podcast It got me upset because this is someone's kid and someone knows she's got that takes a different approach. It was shocking for something like this to happen in our little town. Focusing on the communities affected by life shattering crime. It made news throughout the entire region that these two people had been shot while they slept in such a safe community. To give a new perspective on the devastation crimes can cause. It was shocking for something like this to happen in our little town. Featuring cases from quiet towns to bustling cities and interviewing the people closest to the case. My first thought was that it's an unusual location for us to have a homicide. Listen to the true crime podcast, City Confidential, a step beyond the yellow tape to learn just how far a crime can reach. There are certain cases in the history of Boston that I think sort of define the city. I think this is one of them. New episodes of the City Confidential podcast are available every Thursday. Available wherever you get your podcast. A true crime podcast It got me upset because this is someone's kid and someone knows she's gone. That takes a different approach. It was shocking for something like this to happen in our little town. Focusing on the communities affected by life shattering crimes. It made news throughout the entire region that these two people had been shot while they slept in such a safe community. To give a new perspective on the devastation crimes can cause. It was shocking for something like this to happen in our little town. Featuring cases from quiet towns to bustling cities and interviewing people closest to the case. My first thought was that it's an unusual location for us to have a homicide. Listen to the true crime podcast, City Confidential, and step beyond the yellow tape to learn just how far a crime can reach. There are certain cases in the history of Boston that I think sort of define the city. I think this is one of them. New episodes of the City Confidential podcast are available every Thursday. Available wherever you get your podcast.