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This is not Sam wrestling. Introducing your host from New York here is Sam Roberts. Baby, how are we not Sam wrestling interview bonus show coming at YeoB, everybody is doing well. Subscribe to wherever you subscribe, leaving ratings, reviews, YouTube, the whole deal. Matter of fact, if you want to watch this whole interview, it's also available at YouTube.com. Slash not Sam wrestling. What interview you ask? Well, here in the Not Sam's Studio. I got to sit down with the one and only deathmatch king and the one and only deathmatch queen. Matt Cardona and Steve Verlander, while they were in town defending the House of Glory World Championship against Carlito. They came to the Nazeem studio because it's the stop that everybody has to make. We talked about it all. We talked about Steph delaying or getting added into the insane world that Matt Cardona has created. We talked about the rumors of Matt Cardona having dinner with John Cena, and if that was even true, his friendship with Cody Rhodes and the stories that Cody has spread about him and so much more. For the first time in the not same studio, Matt Cardona, Steph DeLay and her enjoy the Not Sam wrestling interview at long last, I knew it would happen. I just didn't know when. I can't believe this is real. Yeah, no, it's real. It's real. In the Not Sam studio, here we have. The death match King's right, the Indy God. That's right. Always ready. The Michael Jordan of wrestling figure collecting, right? Internet charity internet champion. How to forget the OG. Along with that's right. The indie goddess. That's right. Internet women's wrestling champion, women's internet champions, women's internet champion. Yeah. Death match Queen's Death Match Queen, right? Yeah. The best nickname the 3rd C, the 3rd since I was with the church as the 3rd the U.S. and the baddest b***h on the end and the baddest b***h on the indies. I will take your money through tweets. Steph delay in there. Matt Cardona are here. Welcome to the Nazem Studio. How are you guys? I'm just looking around. I see, you know, I see my product. Major Bendis as the. I see Dan. How's AC Joey Janella? I see the good brothers. Where's the matt major bendy? I'm I'm waiting for the Big Rubber Guy, the big rubber guy available now. Major Pod, MERS-CoV, you know. Also, you could probably take credit for products that you see. That's the Ludvig Borga that your podcast is that the one that's the one with. So, Seth, I know you can't really tell that Ludwig Borga is a very rare figure, right? And it's also have 10 fingers like a normal human. But Sam, who we've seen with them, has done with his life. He's a very accomplished broadcaster. He gets paid by WB, and he can't afford to upgrade that. Ludwig Borg will get that. He doesn't even have all the fingers. What are your thoughts on that? He needs to upgrade Ludwig Borg. Yeah, it was my childhood, so buy a new one. But. Buy a new one. I mean, are you cancelled if I say I don't know who this is? No, you're here. Cancelled. Actually, honestly, Ludovic Borg is probably a good one. Not to know who that is. There's not my job. I mean, guys, yeah. What? What an incredible time to be the both of you. I figure just as as the world is watching. Matt Cardona evolve into the the indie savior. Yes, that you became like a DMs all the times. I thank you for coming the indies and saving us. Who's that damning you? I don't want, you know, it's confidential, but I get on at least 15 times a week. Thank you so much for coming to our territory. You know, teaching us how to sell merch the correct way. You know, teach us how to grab a hold stuff like that. You're like The Undertaker, the indie. What do you do? Sorry, I just was. That's a good question. I rip off my shirt and I choke them with the shirt. Right, OK. Yeah, just just checking work smarter. Not harder. I am the writer taker, which, by the way, got over a million views on social media. Did you watch it? Yeah, of course I watched it. I've actually I was a I wanted to compliment you on your increased production value. I think the people when they do stuff should continue to get better. And you know, you you. True Long Island story is the godfather of all these kind of entertaining wrestling shows. But if you would come out with an iPhone and just kind of vlogging, I'd be like, Man, like, what do you what do you did this? But to see you all something zap, you know, we had this idea. We're going to get together. You can't be half pregnant, right? We got out. We got to force this. We got we got to force this. We got to shove this down people's throats. So we got attacked from all angles, whether it be getting booked all over the world or flooding people's social media feeds. So hey, let's put out a video every single week. And guess what? So it has f**king hard, but we do it. You know, we it is what it is. So how did? OK, so that's that's kind of the first question is that's what I was getting at that people see you as the savior, right? And you're doing it and you do it for the last couple of years. But then twenty twenty three comes around, right? You know, WWE is smoking hot, a w smoking hot like everything's starting to get back to normal. Brian Myers over here signing with impact wrestling. Chelsea Green is signing with WWE back to New York. Me and it's like what? You left behind your eyes. She did prove I stick right and it's like, And you've done the deathmatch thing. You've done the fish out of water like, oh, the WWE Superstar existing in the indie world. Yeah. And I think people were like, OK, like is is that run over? And then all of a sudden indie god, maybe indie god and the next evolution, which is the two of you. So how does how did? Because I feel like people may take for granted that you just be like, OK, let's just do this together. But Steph, I mean, this is not like I've heard you can't get half pregnant. All of us is not pregnant, by the way. I would hope not. She's a deathmatch queen, right? But my point is more that like, you know, you're you're coming out of the WWE system yourself released for my next figuring out like, OK, I'm getting my my, my feet wet. I'm getting in here on the indie circuit. And when you're coupled with the death Match King, it's an all or nothing scenario like this. Matt Cardona, come to you and say, like, OK, this is what I see for us, but you have to trust me with everything you know I want to say. I never heard which fits the scenario. I've never heard her version of the story because we get asked this question a lot. I tell you why. So I was about to say I like to I like to hear your version of the story. I did that. That's it feels fairly inappropriate and almost mansplaining for, you know, Hey, Matt, like how did you? Yeah, I'm more impressed by what we can say anyway. Let me not explain this scenario. Yeah. How do you make the choice to go like, OK? You know, I've got my own thing going on, but I see what's here, and I'm going to put this level of trust in this in this Matt Cardona character. Yeah. I mean, it was like, you know, we were on a tour in Australia and I grew up watching him. I've known him. I've known of him for years. We didn't really know each other personally. I mean, we met each other once, but we didn't really have a relationship. But we were on this tour together in Australia, and he came up to me and was like, Hey, I've asked you a question. And I was like, Oh, f**k. I was like, I think I've done something wrong. Like, I've pissed him off. He's not happy with me. So you question, who the f**k do you think you are? Firstly, I instantly I was like, Oh my God, I've done something wrong because we'd literally never spoken. And he was like, Oh, do you want to like work with me on the indies and like, be my hater? And I was like, Let me just check my really busy schedule of all these days, but I don't have garlic. I was like, Yes, 100 percent. Yes. And then, yeah, I flew home, flew back to America early, and we did a CW show together and just kind of hit the ground running. But we're like what he said before, like with the video, stuff like that was my videographer that I introduced into Matt because I was already doing promos with him. And we have, like Matt, is so all or nothing and I am as well. So we kind of have a similar mindset for all of these things. The difference was like, you know, I had ideas and I wanted to create these promos, but you know, I couldn't afford to do it every week at the time or I wanted to get all these this gear made. But I wasn't doing shows three times a week, so I couldn't, you know what I mean? Like I, I wanted to do all these things, and then I met someone else who wanted to do all those things too. And together now we have more of the resources that we're able to create videos. Every week, we're able to get UK gear for one off shows that we're able to do all that kind of crazy stuff. So I feel like we both had that mindset separately and then like joining forces. It's kind of been perfect, and I think that's why we've done so well in such a short period of time. Was there any worry, though, on your part? Because I mean, the wrestling industry is full of broken promises, right? It's full of people who go like, Here's what we'll deal with, do this. We do that. You never hear from them again, right? Was there any sort of fear or did you know enough about him that you're like, this is 100 percent who he is? There was no fear whatsoever. And to your point, there always is in wrestling, you know what I mean? But this was something that probably that I've been a measure of in my entire wrestling career was like, This is a good idea. And I've never said that. But it's true because like, look, he's how many years you spent in a movie like 14. That's not that doesn't happen by accident, you know, so you've got to be doing something right to even have a job there for that long and then to be able to God, I can't believe I'm blowing so much smoke like we were going away. The only time he ever shuts off is like, Yeah, yeah, discussing. But now what he has created for himself is insane. So if he's been able to do that for himself, you know what? What can we create with me along for the ride? And I said to him very early on I was like, You don't know me yet, but like, you have picked the right person, like whatever you want to do, I will do it 110 percent. Like, I'm up for everything like I will like. I want to run with this as much as you want to run with it. So, yeah, we've both kind of had that mindset, and I think that's why it's done well. It's also like the most wrestling conversation ever to go up to a woman in a locker room and be like, I want to ask you a question, do you want to be my hater? What is that? You know, when Chelsea left like end to go back to New York and Brian Myerson with impact, it was taking less indie dates kind of ruined my shtick because I I am the guy who needs everything. You know, I need the valet. I need the best bud. I need Hornswoggle under the right. Any my lawyer to come out, you know. So without all that, I felt naked, you know, and I like being naked, but not in a wrestling where, you know, I'm not Rory Fox over here. You're not upset about Rory Fox over here. So I needed something. I knew I needed a girl, but who, you know, I wasn't going have a diva search and we were in Australia and I saw her. And I mean, just look at her the piercings. She's like six feet tall. The blonde backs. That girl is it. And I asked her, if you want to be a hater? She said yes. And then I went to the promoter said, Can we do this tomorrow night or whatever or two days? Like, Let's f**kin start it now. Let's not f**king waste our time. Let's f**king go. And then it worked. And then, OK, well, how about getting her booked on all these shows that more booked on GC w cheap Bret does has no, you know, OK, well, f**k you, Bret. I'm going to fly her in. Pay her, I put her up. What do you say about that? Wow. And then and then Bret looks at her goes, Oh s**t. Like, you know, that's a tall, skinny b***h, you know? And then, you know, it's just bringing her along. And, you know, then she's like, emailed the promoters. I'm like, Hey, I'm on this show. Email this from. It just it was a team effort. I mean, but for you to for him to fly you and like, OK, for this first round, I'm going to fly you out on my own dime. And that's how much. I believe in this that's like, oh, my God, like that doesn't happen, right? No, that was yeah, I mean, it was I felt pressure because I was like, there's a lot of there's a lot riding on this, you know? And like, if I s**t the bed, this is a one and done and thanks, but no thanks or like I felt pressure on that day to like, really show out. And you know, I did. I did what was awesome and we did well. And then all of a sudden we're booked on every day, like every day, every show we can do. So it went well, but it was, you know, it was a short term investment for a long term gain. And I think that is something that we apply to a lot of different things, whether it's merch, whether it's gear, whether it's videos, whatever else like, we invest in what we're doing because we see the payoff. And I think that's kind of what makes us different to a lot of indie wrestlers at the moment. You have to invest in yourself, whether it be like, she said, we went to the UK. We are all UK give her for. Did we waste money, I guess? Sure, but it's an investment, it's an investment in the look, the the ever the entrance, just like when we post the pictures all week long afterwards, it's just the presentation that we're superstars and wait till that UK exclusive bendy. Well, yeah, I don't know about that, but we just go all in with everything. And that's that's how I've always with my career. You have to. And no one's going to push us except ourselves. You know, we're self push self-made, and I have no problem doing that. Was there any fear that she was going to flake like his wrestlers or flakes to like? Or were you going? And if she flakes, which did it for one show, I'll find something else on it. Yeah. I mean, I didn't think we didn't have time to think about it. I can't think about it. I found her and literally we did the show in Australia. And then the next weekend we did shows we did ACW Arena after that CW show. We've been doing shows every weekend since, like, I don't have time to think about whether she flakes or what if she sucks and she's going, Hey, that says I didn't care if she can wrestle now. Like, Can you choke? Can you throw a baby powder? You know? Yeah. You know, the best part is that she can wrestle, too, so she wrestles as well. So it's like we have this dynamic where, OK, we have two wrestlers who can either wrestle single on the card or in a tag match or mix that we can do it all. That's what makes us unique, unlike any other pairing in wrestling. Yeah, yeah, absolutely. And I mean, and and so then going forward from this, do you go, Yeah, let's just keep on building on this. Is there are there sort of like benchmarks that you have like, OK, for six months from now, we'll be doing this and 12 months from now, we'll be doing that? Or is it just let's just keep building on it and make it bigger and bigger and bigger? Yeah. Obviously, there's grand plans that we're not going to reveal right now, but it's do as much as we possibly can. I mean, we did the U.K., we're going to f**king Japan. You know, we're trying to just take over this indie scene like weekend by week, and that's what we're doing now. Steph, did you realize? How sincere Matt was about, no, this is my whole life, like I spend every interview he does, he talks about how no, when I'm not when you don't see me, I'm thinking about this. I'm 24 hours a day, seven days a week. Obviously, you've found out. I would assume that this is true. You were ready for that. Yeah, I'm the same way, yeah. That's why after a couple of weeks, it felt like we'd be in taming for six months because, you know, when I had, like in the past, I would be the one being like, Hey, let's do this and imagine I'd be lying in bed at night thinking of ideas or on the plane thinking of my friends. But can we talk about this at the show? Where is like? He and I are both like that, like, we're on the plane texting each other ideas this morning for tonight, you know, I mean, like where it doesn't start from the second we wake up to the second we go to sleep. It's like it is wrestling. And it's it's I think what's exciting too is like, we've both been at debris everywhere. You don't have creative control. And now if we want to film a video, we'll talk about ideas and then we'll make that video that way. You know, so I think we're both really enjoying having the flexibility of being able to be super creative again and like, present ourselves whatever way we want to be saying. And if we want outlandish gear and he wants a cape and a crown and glasses and whatever, he gets that like, I think we're both really enjoying that. But with how 24-7 he is with wrestling on the exact same way. And I think if we've both spoken about, if either of us weren't like that, it wouldn't work the way that it does. Yeah, I definitely think that that's true. Was there more of a learning curve than people realize for you, Matt, when you left WWE in terms of like, I think people almost take for granted that like, you know what you're doing to the point where you just said you're teaching people right, how to operate on a financially successful level at the indies. But when you leave WWE, you don't have any, you know, you have you have, you know, a little tiny bit of indie experience before you get to WWE be of 14 years in the WWE system. That's a different world, right than the independents. So was there a learning curve when you got there or are you just so kind of wrestling minded that it came naturally? I think it definitely came naturally. And I say in interviews that WWE was my developmental and that's not a shot at WB. I'm so grateful for my time there, and if it wasn't for my time there, I wouldn't be the indie guy who wouldn't be sitting with you right now. But everything I learned the WB, how to be a star, how to merchandise, how to like, promote yourself. That's what I'm doing now on the indies. You know, I get to these shows and like, there's people in the locker room like going over there, match, like sell some f**king merch, make some f**king money, make a connection with the audience, whether they love you or hate you, be an a*****e to them. I don't give a thought, but make them hate you. Make them love you, whatever. I'm just using that mentality like, this is not my honky tonk man run. You know this is my like. I'm going to change the f**king business run and change my career run. And like everything that I've learned from, from f**king WWE to like last weekend and one P.W., I'm always learning something and every match I try to learn something from every opponent and that's just how I operate. You know, I like to soak it all up, and I f**king will use everybody before me. What I've learned from them and apply it to make myself a success. You have to in this business. Yeah, at least I do. You know, what am I for you? Stuff like? I mean, when you get released from next, it's like, you're just kind of I'm sure that you had vision. You had envisioned what your future would look like. And then in in an instant, it's like, No, it won't. It's going to look completely different. And you might not have any idea what that looks like. Was that a scary thing when you first got put into the wild? And then like, now you're kind of on your own now? Yeah, I mean, it was like I had spent some time on the indies in Australia, which are very different to the indies in America. I done a couple of tours on the indies in America, but not much. So then when I got released, it was kind of this like super shock to the system and I was digging my heels in and I didn't want to do it. And it was evident in every way. Like I, the last thing you want to do is go back to the indies when you just signed your dream job. And you know, I'd gotten given this money and promises of more money and WrestleManias and belts and this and that and then all of a sudden championships champion championships championships. But yeah, to go from you did learn a lot from all of that to then, you know, getting shut out the back and back and into the indies again. You just like what's going on. So then I kind of had to and I and I felt it in myself and I knew that it, it wasn't connecting and I wasn't enjoying myself because I I did a few shows because I had to do for my visa. And I just was like, This, isn't it? Like, I love wrestling, but I hate wrestling right now, and I don't want to like rage, quit and just fully give it up. So I took like six months off, which was like a strategic break. And I was like, I need to learn to love this again. I need to miss it. I need to like, step away and figure out who I am and what I'm going to be. So I had six months off and then when I came back, it was like, right just before I kind of met him. Then I like I sat down. I wrote out my one year, three year, five year and lifetime goals of like, what do what do I want to achieve? And honestly, I knew a big part of that was Jake. Because when you look around like Jason Darby is the biggest indie, you know, and even in WWE, you can say that everyone knows Jay C.W is the place to be on the indies. But for me, that was daunting because I hate deathmatch wrestling. The deathmatch queen. I just I'm terrified of it, I hate it. I can't even watch it, I am. So I was like, Where do I fit in in his death company? You didn't even watch death. No, I literally I was standing the mesh table. I couldn't watch it like, I hate it. So I was like, Where do I fit in? But then I realized, like, Oh, I fit in by being the opposite of what everyone else is like. We the, you know, sports entertainers on a death match Indy show, and that's the whole shtick. And also, the locker room is awesome. Like the people are great. Like I, I really had to have a huge like mindset shift instead of like, Oh, I have to go back and do the knees and minimum until like, Oh, I get to go back and like, rewrite my path and I get to go and do all these things that I couldn't do while I was in WWE. So I really had to change the way I was looking at things how to make your partner like you again with post me here that that salmon sashimi fresh so fresh, you muting email now, Carol, because you were busy using chopsticks and not venting about traffic on the floor or fire as soy drips on your stretchy sweat pants, get sashimi on Postmates for $30 off your first three orders of $35 or more. Use code L.A. Throw terms apply. Yeah, and I think that that's that's that's you can always tell who's designed to be in wrestling long term versus they're there because that's where opportunities brought them. When something like that happens, because it's like, Am I getting sent back to the indies? It's like, No, you're not going back to where you were before, because now you're this person who either comes from next or comes from WWE. And it's like you. All that stuff that you did still counts. You're just bringing that with you to the place that you're at now. And that's why I think what you guys are doing works now. I remember, Matt, you were you didn't want to do this Nic Cage death match in this. So this was, I mean, at a time when when Nic Cage was fresh off dark side of the ring, right, fresh out of jail, he's very feared a human being in general. Yes. And I mean, it's just not. You're you're you're I mean, you're a pretty man, a very pretty. You know, the saying so like the aesthetic is important to you. And generally speaking, in the genre of death match aesthetic, aside from the aesthetic of seeing glass shatter or flesh tear, you know, they're not tanning. No, they're not. For a couple of days, I'll tell you, I don't even know a guy named him, but so for you, it's like when you go, OK, I'll do this. You couldn't have known when you walked into GW how much of an impact you would have known. I'm sure you knew it would be cool, right? But I mean, I remember talking to you right after it and you were talking about the high that you got from realizing that, like, Oh no, they don't just hate me. Like, this is like territory heat. This is old school. They despise me. Dave Meltzer is sitting there defending their reaction. Like, This is wrestling. This is we're really doing it. Is it is it difficult after you get to that high to find it again? So, you know, when I left WWE, I knew I needed a change. Even while I was in WWE, you know, I dropped that we will drop the headband, drop the glasses. But like I was saying earlier, you don't have all this creative control. You can only do so much, right? So when I left, I knew I needed to change the A.W. thing. The cup of coffee there didn't work out, so it's like, OK, at the time, I was f**king bummed out, like aliment, 100 percent. But now blessing in disguise, right? Because I would have never been able to go to gsw and do that death match the match that changed my career changes. UW changed my life. But you're right. Like that that high. Like, I knew it was going to create some waves and create some buzz, but I could not anticipate what it would do. And I think we're all chasing that next buzz, Jason, that next highlight, right? And that's that's why I think if you're a true wrestling fan, that's why you're in this to really chase it. Yes, the money, we're all chase the money, too, but we're chasing the glory. We're not necessarily the fame, but like we all grew up wanting to be the main event wanting to have the ATV. You're wanting to be on a T-shirt. At least I did. I know stuff. Did you know that's that's the goal. And to ride that momentum is the funnest part and also the hardest part, right? So it's like, I don't know what the next thing is, but I'm going to keep f**king trying until we find it, you know, like this Indy God thing? We joke about it. It was just a one night outfit that I thought would be, haha, funny. And I don't wanna say it blew up, but I was smart. Ross, Okay, people are talking about this in a way like I should. I should say what I should do with it to sink my teeth into it. And now, like I sell Indy God f**king hats. Like it's a ridiculous, you know, I think that something for me as a fan that's key to watching wrestling is that when the characters don't blink right, right? When they're not winking, when they're not like, Yeah, I'm in on it too. Yeah. And for me, it's like, I think what makes the Indy guy the guy does the same thing that makes the deathmatch king. It's you going out there looking as ridiculous as I've ever seen a human being. But your facial expression is like as serious because it's. It's not a joke, right? This is not like an SNL skit. You're almost like looking like, can you believe how cool I look? I do. I f**king kidding how amazing I'm going to be. And I'm like, I guess I was laughing at first, but I guess this is this is cool, because look at that guy's face. That's right. Right? The only place I'm laughing to the bank. Be laughing all the way to the bank. That's right. That's right. And that's the other thing. When you're selling hats like that, you can't sell hats like that when you're not wearing any guy. That's right. I listen. I said this before I made more money in the last year than I ever may be on the indies now. It's because of the podcast and Sam's, you know, the cosmic crumb cake. Yeah, you know, the podcast major bands, the merged everything, but I have no problem working hard and working my a*s off, and I know stuff the exact same way. And that's why this really works, because it could have just been like some girl who made the shows every know once a week again. But now we travel together. We make sure this works. We're texting all the time. We're filming these videos on our off days doing all this bulls**t because the bulls**t is what's going to make us better than everybody else, right? Right. Yeah. And I mean, that's the part of the independence. Is that like even if there are people who have never seen you guys work together, they know who you are because of the social media. That's right. They know, like the brand exist or even an independent show. And so they're going to come and go like, I keep hearing about this, and that's why we flood the social media with the videos, the pose. We always make sure. But like tonight, we have a match will take pictures before we'll take pictures, after we'll cut a promo and we'll use it all next week to the next show. Because we don't have a WWE, we're not on their main TVs, right? And we haven't been in the act for that long. So we're going to force down your f**king throat, right? Did you really sit in a room with like executives of a company and say, like, look, first and foremost, I'm not wearing a nightmare family jacket. I'm not doing any of that Cody Rhodes stuff, is that a true story I read on the internet? There's there's some truth to that, but it's the Cody story. There are some. I didn't. I did not want to be a part of the nightmare family. That is true, but I do have the jacket in my closet. And if you want to buy it in the book back card, I'll think about selling it. Is your name on it? It's a strong island on the front. You're not wearing about. But I mean, listen, I thought the A.W. thing. Let me ask you this. Did you say that in a room that Cody was in at the same time? That's not true. OK, that is untrue. That is that is not true. I don't know the story of Cody's story, right? Cody, sorry, I did. I'll tell you, that's the day I met Tony Khan. I pitched, Hey, we should drop by figure. Exactly. Like, it was not the first night preorder. This never been done. No, I mean, and you know what? That's why people don't get it. But that would have never been done. It would have been so never been done right. But if you're not an action figure collector, you don't go get it. You don't get it. So when as an actor pro, I would order it believable, of course. Imagine this guy jump ship and you can f**king preorder his figure that night. There's already a render. Yeah, you know, I'm saying a hundred percent f**king would it change the business? Well, the wrestling business? Yeah. Then you're bragging about. I went to A.W. because I got an action figure on day one. When did you? You're right. I mean, I will say I've had two matches there, but three T-shirts. So yeah, that's good, man. So I mean, seriously, you imagine a promo on dynamite where you're sitting there would be like Jan. three should. I did, I did. You sitting there looking and Jon Moxley in the face going, how long did it take you to get an action from that point on night? One motherf**ker? You know, that's he. That's he. That is he. I wasn't. I wasn't a heel yet. You should have got to be. You have to be. Look, Steph, do you worry? Because like? I mean, Matt hasn't done a lot of death matches, but he did the one. Yeah, I was there. I was on the gig. I know she's my queen. Yeah. But do you worry that at some point, like there's got to like, that's the thing about being a great villain is a payoff has to happen. Eventually, there has to be a payoff. Are you concerned that look, at some point I might have to step in to at least a death match ring. I might have to go through some glass and tubes and whatnot. Yeah, I'm terrified. We talk about it. I tell him every week I go, I don't want to do it. I'm not doing it. And he's like, and at some point, maybe I don't know if I'm telling tales out of school, but I had to watch this man explain to death match wrestlers why detox glass is not the same. But yeah, have these slim and people that are some. I don't know if that is the detail as those shelves that that say I was over there with the things on display. I hope that is for gla*s. Jake, I didn't have a death match. I had a normal wrestling match. Yeah, 'cause that's what happens. It happens. But you of you? Look, the thing is right. Like, obviously, I'm not stupid. At some point I'm going to be having one death match safe and spectrum, but it's going to be the best death match you ever seen. Not as good as yours is going to be the second best match you've ever seen. Yeah, and that's just because that's the way that I do it. That's the way he does. It will be in it together, probably. So the thing is is like when we do it, it's going to be insane. So as much as I'm terrified of it. And that's that's the beauty of the area legitimately, legitimately f**king to. We were at the show the other week. I literally was like, I cannot watch. I can't watch it like, I hate it. Yeah, but you know, I will. I'll put my big girl pants on for a day to give the people what they want, but it will be insane. So I love that the the death match king thing and how it came about is so I know to be true because I remember texting Matt and Brian Myers, a picture of a figure of Oneida. And at the time, he, Matt Cardona, said, Who's that? I don't know. I know Nader is a guy that's not really the perfect queen. Exactly. Absolutely perfect. But now, look, I have made figures for guys in Nick Gage himself, Joey Janella, happy, you know, so I am giving back to the business lesson. I'm not here to pass the torch. I'm here to light a new one for myself. Yeah, but I love that. I, you know, I was that way. Yeah, I've just never heard that. I love that because I'm if I can og am I an innovator? But what I would say is, but if I can help some guys or girls along the way, so be it right. You know, I will pass on my knowledge, whether it be in-ring stuff, navigating backstage merchandising. Sure, I'll do that. But it's not about them. It's about me now. It's about her and I together. What do you think about the physique, though, right? I mean, you're jacked. That's part of the deal, right? You think that like that? People can get by without being jacked up, or I think those days are long gone, you know, I mean, I wish I looked like the warlord, but I don't, you know, like those those days are gone, I think. I mean, look at like, you know, all over the business, there's all different shapes and sizes, and that's fine. Me personally, I want to look like a 1990s WWF wrestler. That's my preference. If you don't look like that, that's fine. There are plenty who look, who don't like that, who are wildly successful. That's right. So I have nothing, you know, I don't care about that. How long did the did your tan take? Well, yesterday I went to the beach in Florida, and then I went to the tanning salon after the beach. I did go in the back. I did not go with the bad guy. I was going to say, I'm like, I'm not listening to your sunburn. So it's usually a triple dip which is laying in the bed. They get two sprays. Yesterday, I just double dipped. So I said I went to the beach. Oh, so this isn't even the max I did last night, for reference. Yeah. So this is what a double dip should look like. And that's why I had some natural sun. You know, like Hogan, like Hogan would, right? What would Terry do? You know? So got that right? That's right. So I went to the beach, then I got two sprays and then when I got home because I had tanned and I wasn't wearing like a speedo, my legs weren't as tan as my body. So then I got Chelsea to give me some of her tanning cream, and then I had my legs with a coat. Terry, what a tan in a speedo. He would have. He would. He would have. Yeah, maybe, Terry, if you're listening, we'll go to Tampa. Clearwater will tend to speedos together. I think it's a good idea. Or you join us. Can I come? Yeah. Everybody in speed are just Mexican for the camera. What is something that hasn't worked for you? You know, you've you've talked about this before. You said things like what, what? What's what's been something recently not like way back in the day when you were trying, but like, what's something that you're like, OK, I think this will probably do well, but did nothing. I did nothing. So for I thought it'd get over if I started, call myself the agent. Like, there's so many, there's free agents, but I'm the age. I even trademarked the race of thousands of dollars, so it's still by going the agent I'm thinking about, like Ari from Entourage, is going to be a. It's the way you say it, you know, like the agent. Like, there's so many free agents that I'm the agent. I still believe that I am the we are the agents. It's about how you look at the landscape of pro-wrestling. There's always free agent, but we are the agent. If you're the Booker man and whatever company and you're looking for your star, how do you not? I got it. You're still trying to sell it. But like when you say I'm the indie guy, I'm like, Oh, cool, you see the dead man's king. I'm like, Oh, cool, and you're like, We're the agents. I'm like, All right. Yeah, OK. It didn't work like it didn't work out. And what would she be like? OK, because like if your deathmatch king and queen knows only God and goddess would you? Would she be the other agent? I wouldn't let him. I was. I would say no. If he asked me before we tamed if he should trademark the agent, I would have said absolutely not. So, OK. So for instance, like, OK, so she would if I was the agent and it took off, she would become like a part of it. So the agents. But for instance, so when I first got like, I'm like, OK, let me. OK, so when I got released, I trademarked major player and it didn't really take off. But then Brian Myers, we became the major players that took off, right? Right. So yours. It's like, Yeah, yeah, right. But now it's like, I'm the major player. I get kind of like the British Bulldogs. Yeah, you know, Davey Boy went solo y like he was the British bulldog. Davey Boy Smith. What was it? No, but obviously it wasn't the British. It's OK because they're way better than the Rockets. That would mean that Brian's the dynamite kid. That's awesome. Well, right. But it wasn't the British Bulldog Dynamite Kid, right? It was a football game, right? So you are, you're going to you're the major player always ready. I wish Brian Myers was along for this ride, but unfortunately he has a family and he likes to be home with his family, which I'm not saying. Unfortunately for me, fortunately for him, I would love to have him here and we still, you know, he was involved the first night Steph was there. But you know what? It makes it special when he shows up. Absolutely. Because Hammerstein Ballroom, when he came in, when he came in with that f**kin the edge, the edge, the Oh my, I keep sending her the magic. Please watch us. She never if I said or something about 45S, I guess you won't watch the match or your match by match. She won't you everything you won't watch. Thomas, I bolded the Hammerstein Ball. You know, what does it? Do you know what an accomplishment it is? The CW did the sold out sign ballroom sold out? I do, but I was the marquee match. And yeah, shut the f**k up for once. I mean, I know I'm making a stand because he sends me too many videos to watch and I don't want to watch any of them. So now I've just said I'm not watching any of them. How much of the videos that he sends are his stuff. Oh oh, oh yeah. He like his is forty three minute YouTube vlog from eight years ago. I didn't know, I said to fast forward to four fifty. I know. I honestly like it naive me, I figured that, like you center some of your favorite moments that inspired you like watch this match from ICW when I say this cool thing that I did. Well, I try showing her me and Jojo at Super Gaby's. You ever see that we're just, you know, attacked me while I was doing? Yes. Yeah. She want to see why I clicked on it and I scroll and I went there fighting in a toy store. OK, wait, what was the purpose of her watching you enjoyed, you know, fighting a Super Gaby's because you wanted to do? You wanted me to go with you and do. Yeah, the super gallant. In some ways, he began. Yeah. And you thought that you would see the magic and go like, Oh, super Gabby. Definitely inspired to shoot an angel. Like, We got to do this. Yeah, I heard it exactly wise in that particular video, but maybe something like that. Right, right, right. Right. Oh man. I can only hope that at some point the super Gabby. Well, cameo, do you know Super Gabby stuff? I met him. Lost House of Glory. He was just there. He was like, He might be there again tonight, you know? Yeah. So you're the you're also that you're the House of Glory world champion. I have so many titles. I'm losing track battle, but you beat Jacob Fatu. I did a hell of a competitor. Holy s**t. I mean, this is pretty close to being a member of the bloodline. Well, I'm a member of the figure line. You know, I don't know if the figure line is going to take off. It doesn't make any sense. That makes more sense of the bloodline. Well, the bloodline is a bloodline. It's like a figure like, you know, line of figures. You've ever heard a figure? I don't know. Like a series of, yeah, yeah. Yeah, no. Okay. Hey, Dawkins, don't bill me for that one. Oh, I love it. But yeah, I mean, he's he is amazing. Were you? When you go into these spots, are you? Are you surprised that they're willing to let you carry the mantle or do you feel entitled to it? It's actually the opposite. I don't want to, because like they put me in this position, I'm obviously going to beat their guy. You're right, you probably guessed it Jim. I'm going to win. And then they expect you to like they expect me to, like, bring their title everywhere. How many f**king titles are you complaining about having eight championships right now? This true story. Last House of Glory. I had won my eighth title. We went to the hotel. My bag broke from too many belts. I legitimately thank God our flight the next morning to the Championship to recover. Yeah. To which everything Sam, thank God I played was later. The next morning, I can go to a target and get a new bag. Wasn't to me a puke gross Jimmy socks. Jimmy was the one that broke. Yeah, but at least if I was home, I could have you got. Have you got a new Jimmy since? No, I still I don't. I don't go to the f**king Apollo one, right? You're still using the tag on. I time to go to all these other s**t. Right, exactly. So I'm here tomorrow, right? Oh, I got it. Defeats the purpose. I got it. It's tough. So you're saying it's like being the champion of all its promotion of everywhere World Series wrestling in Australia, you know, House of Glory in New York, you're going to forget one. Of course. Do you ever get confused being the wrong promotions title? I sometimes like, I always like, Make sure what promotion am I the champion? Like make sure before always the internet champion. Oh oh, the most prestigious title in wrestling, right? Besides, well, the women's is second. What is it? Then the the men's internet right does change the business. Well, you could have said that the two internet championships are the most prestigious, but you did make clear just now that hers is the second most because that's where you say the dynamic is. Yeah, well, she has time to. Maybe I noticed that he said that you guys text on the plane when you're on the same flight. Right? Yeah, it's because he's sitting up in first and I'm back in row for one point forty seven in the middle. Tell the truth. One time I let her sit in. First I swap. He let me finish first, and then he goes. When he did it, he goes just to let you know if this flight was longer than an hour, I would not be doing that, but I wanted to get it on. Just know he was a kid. I just love the dynamic and he brings up every interview. We have you guys. All right. Nah, I don't think it's ever been made. Now you did. You mentioned it last week. I love the dynamic of you guys going in the airport and then him saying, All right, see you later, champ. He does watching you as you go to the back. Yeah, no, that's how it is. Not true stuff. Come on. Yeah, she got to the airport before me today, actually. Yeah. And then he texted me, Guys, that's weird because you bored way before she does. He tells me he was, You're late. I was like, No, OK, so Steph, the late now. Yeah, I'm I'm not putting over your s**tty pause. So he said that and I was like, No, I'm here. He's I'm usually late, but he was late today. Now, speaking of of of Cody's stories, Cody also said that you he was surprised the information about his WWE return didn't leave because you knew it was. You were part of the advice panel. I was, but you're a stooge, he said. I'm not you, right? No. He said that he was surprised that Cody Matt Cardona didn't stooge it off. Cody Cody. He feeds me information that I feel like he wants me to tell people, right? So I never said anything because I. And with Cody, you know of the truth or Cody lie, we all know it. You know, Cody Rhodes, you know, Cody Rhodes. Well, this is a true story this you won't understand this, but there's a very famous Hasbro wrestling figure of Dusty Rhodes right now. There's this rumor and innuendo that there's one with yellow boots. Right, right, right. And nobody's known staff. Is it because dusty as white boots, nobody's people have they've debated? No, I seen a picture, but it just sounded like I bought one before. It's clearly stated. So this is like Sasquatch, but a wrestling figure? No, because it's does it exist? The only way to prove it existed is if there was a mint on card, a mock version which Cody and the rest of the card would have to be cleaned. The Sun damaged. Cody said that he had one and he brought it to TV and all them. Cody showed me this figure. Show me this figure ! Long story short, he's too busy doing if they just go in my bag and look for it. So of course, I go through his bag. It's not there because it exists. And then you tell the boys that weather is bad, you know, like, that's a Cody Rhodes story for Steve Bruce. He's gone through that. Yeah, yeah, that's Cody wrote. So when he told me that, like Vince flew down, like after he did go to you. But I gave him advice, right? As if it were true. And I said, Cody, like, there can only be one first. They go back to make the ship the jump ship, you know. And he did it because you also gave him advice when he left right when you left IBEW. The first thing I am, I might have said if he said I did not take the credit. Yeah, but you're not for the record, you're not a steward. I'm not a stooge. No, I this is the first I've heard of. You have rethinking. Everybody has also spread rumors that I'm a pecker checker. What's a package I? Well, what do you guys do when you've been in the shower right now? Like, this is the kind of guy code he is that he's, he says, like in public that I'm a stooge of a checker. Are you a banker checking that I check my own pecker? Yeah, especially if he is the Blucher. You make sure it works. Right, right, right. Sure, sure. Of course. Of course, you got to make sure your investment is right on point, but you're not. For the record, I feel like, you know, I like my interviews to have like a value for the consumer, right? Like, you need to come away like they take away anything from. It's your looks at guy's dicks in the shower. No, no. I am not a student on record, nor pecker. OK? Neither one. Or to phrase it differently. Cardona is just as much as stooge as he is a pecker checker. Oh. That's a clickbait headline. I. Okay. That's a clickbait. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. Wow. Wow. I mean, that's you. Learn something new every day. No, I think it's yeah. Are you? Are you rethinking that? I am. Yeah. It's not the first time I've been friends with the rat. So now I'm just like, What do I do it? But luckily, there's no there's no showers on the indies. Can be a pack Jagger anyway. Right? There's no showers, though. She CW locker room. There's not even a locker room offers on what is by magic. There's no what is left. It's a nightmare. Yeah. When did you get used to that lifestyle, Matt? Like, I mean, coming from where you came from, the idea that like, no, no, no, no, no. Like you just said a minute ago, yeah. GW is the top. Yes. Like, there's no better. Yes, the as far as independence go and you're changing in an alleyway. I just the first time I experienced it like that, I said, like, this is it? You know it is what it is. Just f**king suck it up. But one thing that I did wasn't, I can't. I'm not going to, you know, get a bus. You know, they're like, Hey, Cody, bus, you know, but one thing I do do. And now that I've sat with me, like, I don't have like, don't send your f**kin minion to pick me up from the airport. I rent my own car on my own dime. The email schedule staff come on board, you know, like, this is our life. We're gods so often like, I need to be enjoying what I'm doing. If I'm going to be miserable, if I can change in an alley or f**king like, you know, sip on one bottle of water for five hours, you know, I have to make sure that the rest of that no cater. Yeah, I have to make sure that the rest of the day is as smooth as possible. Yeah. Oh, so you'll make the investment to go like just whatever I can do to find my peace. Absolutely. Yeah. It's whatever it is, $100 million bucks a day. It's worth it. Yeah. And it sounds crazy, but it's worth it. No, I didn't like have some minion pick you up his a*s. He doesn't work. He's f**kin trying to talk to you. Then you either talk him back. You don't wanna talk, you're texting. You're being mean. You look like an a*****e. Yeah. Oh, stop. Yeah. One time with that, I said, never again rented a car. So for the right, that's the other. Take away the whoever you are out there. Yeah, the one person that picked up Matt Cardona, if you've ever picked him up at the airport, I understand you're the guy. You're the one. Oh, you're excited to f**king work. Yeah. Now there's no way that it's not my acting. Oh, you're very lovely, though. I just I can't deal with that s**t. Yeah, they love the guy. But yeah, my name is a nice guy, too. I love it. I've been hearing about the construction of your new house on the major podcast, The New Figure Room. That's right, being constructed staff. Have you sort of familiarize yourself with the action figure culture since then? Like, for me, it's second hand. Like I listen to major podcast because they talk to wrestling for everybody. Is it all right, Sam? Come on ! I don't say the same wrestling. No, you're right. The Major Wrestling Figure podcast. I listen to it because this is this is I mean, obviously, this is the stuff I've been into since I was a little kid and never stopped. But like, there was a learning curve for my wife, for example, where it's like, no, you know, like, this is a whole lifestyle. And now she gets it. She's not a hobbyist, she's not a collector. She's not with me on it. But like when I'm coming home, she knows where I am. If I'm at target, I'm not buying clothes. Yeah, you know, is this something that you have become accustomed to? I feel like talking about trial by fire. I mean, we're not married, so I don't have to deal with this s**t in a way like I'm not obliged to like, you know, I don't know how you are on the road, right? And I know well what we make and targets that when we go into target, we go, See you in ten minutes, I'll go get food or f**k around, do what I want. He'll go to the figure section and then I'll come and find him, and he'll go by for things that he doesn't need. It is what it is. I don't dislike figures. I mean, I think that. But it's not one of my hobbies, you know, I've got a few other interests outside wrestling figures isn't one of them, so I don't dislike it, but it hasn't, like turned me into a huge wrestling figure fan. Right? But what I will say is he's got a whole like community of fans that are just fans of their podcast and you know, him and Brian and the whole crew. And, you know, because of that, I've kind of become part of that, too. I've joined the Facebook group and I f**k around with the fans and stuff. So I've got like a whole crop of new fans that are now interested in me and what I'm doing, and they buy my match and stuff. So in a way like it really does benefit me and I'm very thankful for it. So, yeah, the community side of it, I think, is awesome. Just like the actual figure is like, I don't really know much about it. Did you really have dinner with John Cena? I did. That's awesome. I did. That goes about it, right? He was texting me all day. Just got my dinner with John Cena. It's not sorry. I won't be available tonight. I'm just going out to dinner with John. I know you tell me I don't see the way I miss John Cena. I spent a small amount of time with him in a room with microphone. You delivery break down to the basement, though. No, I would trust me. I'm already trying to figure out, OK, how do I finagle John to come? Because this is where the real conversations are. The magic. This is where the magic happens. I mean, how did the dinner with John Cena come about? Is this have you just been remained friends since your time? Have you know, John was somebody who, you know, he saw what I was doing with the 09 story. It's like this kid like, wants it. And he gave me so much advice. There's so many things outside of the ring is that the ring that I owe to John Cena? So what is something that the same advice that John Cena gave you? Because I mean, just spending a small amount of time with him in like an interview situation, I was blown away by it. You know, I've put in clips out from the interview and I was reading all the fans that were like just listening to this guy. The level of wisdom and the level that he's working out when it comes to wrestling is like insane. Oh, insane. And I think the number one thing like the merchandise, how important it is. Yeah, right? And like, you know, every couple of months, he would switch up everything switchable the colors. It's it's the orange. And it's not just the new shirt, it's the wristbands, it's the hat. They change the on the top right and the towel. So he knows what he's f**king do it. And he's John Cena for a reason. Yeah. How about him coming out at what was at SummerSlam in the like limited edition yesterday and t shirt and t shirt, right? Like he know, the merchandise is so, so important, and he's like the king of it. Yeah, so anything I could like pick his brain on, I would. It's do you do you feel like that that's that's what has attracted people, do you who kind of love wrestling is that they see that thing in you? They're like, Oh, this this back then this kid's for real. Because I mean, John Cena was a big yes. Zack Ryder, Yeah. Supporter, yes. You know, when I was doing that YouTube show, it was guys like Jay-Z who had retweeted or post about it or Steve Austin or DDP. You know, I'm saying like one of those guys who would post about it that would make people watch and give it a chance. Then they're watching it and they realize this kid is just like us. He's a fan who grew up loving this, and they it made them root for me. Even to this day, some of those fans I saw and some some of those fans, I wrestle now and it was even crazier. That's why people who try it, who tried to be bros. I wrestled a brochure of the week. Yet people have tried to be, you know, yeah, you know, I haven't the successful rescue that we get. So if you're out there, let me know. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, I mean, stuff, you and I are in a similar boat where I think we've both. He's tweeted pictures of both of us out at a Zack Ryder autograph signing. Yeah, yeah. I met him when I was a fan. You know, I like to separate WrestleMania, so it's pretty crazy for me to be, you know, in the position that I'm in. And yeah, for someone that I literally grew up watching on TV to be tagging with. But then also like the number one person on the indies like like that night when he asked me to be or the next day when he asked me to work with him, I like drove him and my parents in Australia from the show, and they were like, Oh, like, what's the deal with like this matt guy? And I was like, He is. I was like, There is not a single person on the indies that I would rather take, like, this is best case scenario for my career. Like, this is the best thing that could have happened. I'm the John Cena is seriously hard. I can't think of anyone that's charging more money than you. And if they are, they shouldn't be like, You know what I mean? Pharrell Yeah. But what you thought about with that meeting me like fan access, I was always wondering, like, were you all like to beat me? Or was there like, who was before you all switched to this? You know, like who you like trying to meet the core? I got up there. I'm sure. I'm sure. Sure. Why are you wearing a cane mask to hide her? I mean what? I'm sure at least one of them. I was there to meet you, people. Either you got to be the internet champion, but I also think that there's an endearing quality. It's obnoxious, but also endearing like a lot of people. If they're going, if they're have a friendly relationship with John Cena and they're going to dinner with him, they're cool about it, right? You're not cool about that. No, it's so cool about it that I could publicly say I'm friends with John C. If we got dinner, well, you're not that cool to like, text your person that you work with and go like, Hey, guess what? I'm going to dinner, right? That's not like because I know how obnoxious. It sounds like that old time he'll text me, be like, Oh my god, the worst thing ever just happened to me. I'm like, What just happened? He goes, The overhead bin space in first class was falls like I had to put my back in coach while was sitting in a row. Forty eight on the toilet. Hey, hey. Well, that way. Anyways, you're way off the plane. Can you pick my bag up for me? Actually, did that actually in row? 15. Yeah, you pick it up. I was just waiting there like a schmuck. Just hold on to grab it. Yeah. So he does it all the time. Yeah. Oh, is it tough to deal with? I mean, you know, I saw you guys, you five bags checked baggage. Normally there's one more. But this was not a death match king weekend to bring the Crown Crown. The Crown has his own bag and you have to bring the crown this. Not this weekend, this weekend, but there I have four bags on me right now. So but this is why you got to think about this stuff 24-7. Like you're neurotic. There's no like, yeah, like a lot of people would just go like, Oh, whatever, I don't think about the trip until right before I leave, but you have to. I mean, everything's very wator and think about it. Either way, it's more than just ready to go. Yeah, but the thing is, it's like all of that stuff to me, it's all the like extra 10 percent or five percent that not many other people in the indies do. So it's like that's the little extra mile of coming and doing this. The day of a show flying in a suit, having bringing three or four checked bags for a two day thing, like all of that stuff, that sure, there is an easier way to do it. Sure, this is a bit of a headache, X-Y-Z, whatever. But that is what separates like the great from the good. And I think you know it, it all pays off in the long run. Do you see like Cody's return to WWE and how he did it in a way that was fairly atypical, right? Like this? Clearly, Cody's return is specialized for color, right? Right. It capitalizes and acknowledges everything that he did after leaving WWE and comes in with that, which we really haven't seen before. Like we've seen people come in with a wave of momentum, but not in a way where clearly like the fact that he's bringing his music back. I mean, listen, you said not once in wrestling history has someone jump ship with their music, right? Never right. Never been done. That's what that until I come back. We were right. But that's what struck me at WrestleMania, right, when like seeing it was the logo for me, right? Seeing the Nightmare Factory family logo show up and go like, this is this is him and this is the first time. Well, if you're going to get tattooed on your neck, you know, if it's on your seems, he has earned everything that he's getting right now. But do you look at that and go like, OK, like I know now where the goalposts absolutely do. And you know, his run on the indies as well as guys like Drew McIntyre? Yes, I stole from both of those and then added my own twist. And hopefully the next guy steals from all three of us. Yeah, you know, I'm saying because I'm adding, I'm adding on to things that they weren't doing, and I hope the next guy is down to the things that I wasn't doing. And that's just how it's going to be to jump off that as well. I literally I got fired and I texted Drew and I said, Hey, what did you do? And yeah, he goes, I did this. This, this, this, this and this. You should do it. And so I literally I always go back and read the messages and everything that he told me to do. I applied to every single show, and I think it's to. If you want the role of someone else, why would you not look at what they've done? Yeah, and follow that. And then, as Matt said, add to it and at least try right? Like, there's certain things that Cody didn't work for Cody so well that I tried. It did not work for me. Like, for instance, I tried like having like the agent guy did not work for me, right? So now I do everything. You want to book me, book Matt Cardona gmail.com. I mean, like you had you, you. And that was like the worry. OK, so you had like a guy, a guy who like it was great, but like, I, I love this s**t. Yes, you know, I want to be hands on. I want to know what the f**k the negotiations are. I want to know every little detail. Not that he wasn't good. He was great, but I want to f**king control in WWE. There's only like for a guy like me, there was only so many things I can control now. I can control f**king everything, and I f**king love it. Yeah, I want to control every aspect of it, whether it be f**king the booking, whether it be the f**king merchandise, whether it be my f**king figures, all the bulls**t. I want to be involved in all the bulls**t, every detail, every f**king detail. And she's just like that. That's why we get along so f**king well. And it's not just like a business thing, like we were friends and whether we're friends do his business or not, it's because we keep f**king texting each other, calling each other ideas, ideas, ideas, ideas. It is even though heaven we might not ever do. We're just always f**king thing going to s**t because we want to get to the next level and above it also. But I think the key to that would you guys have both done well is that you have to make it so that, OK, if you want to come back, if you were to come back and you wanted to do so on your three seasons? Well, yeah, I know about the three seasons I've heard one of them is right here in the studio with us. That's one of the other two are cash creative. But you wanted, you wanted if you want to be able to do that on your own terms. For instance, you're coming back as Matt Cardona. Yeah. I think what you need to do is leave and make it so that Matt Cardona or Stephanie Leander is a more valuable brand than Zack Ryder or Persia Perrotta, right? And I argue that we've done that. I would argue that you've done it, too. I mean, but that's really rare. I mean, the WWE is a machine that they put behind their branding, which means that you two have to operate as machines right to create brands behind these names that weren't exposed by. Absolutely. I think it's really rare, and I think it's rare because it's very, very hard. And I honestly don't think there want people to take this wrong way. I don't think many people are willing to put in as much work as that takes to get there. They're not like, Hey, right now, they're not they're not like I and I have no sympathy for that. Like we, we work and we work and we don't stop working. We fly in on like a Sunday afternoon or Sunday night or whatever, sometimes a Monday morning and Monday morning at nine a.m. We're up filming videos all day like it doesn't. We do not have downtime. I don't see my friends right now. I don't date people like I don't do anything other than work, train, eat, sleep and then do it all again. But that's that is for right now, this period of my career and his career. That is what we need to do to be in the position that we're in. It's not by accident like we very easily could have gotten replaced and just like become irrelevant and toiled away and gotten our little paychecks and being happy to wrestle in front of 50 people for the next few years. But like, I didn't want that for myself, he didn't want that for himself. And I think, yeah, it's it's very it's very hard work, and I don't think many people are willing to do it. And I think that is the only reason why we've done to, you know, have you guys? I mean, clearly everybody's aware of what's going on, right? Everybody in wrestling is aware of what's happening. But have you either of you guys gotten kind of notes from higher up people in other organizations going like, We see you? We're aware. I have not. I've not been in any communication with anybody. They know my numbers. So listen, I would have a phone call to anybody, but I don't know if I would go back to either big company right now. I feel like we're f**king killing it. No matter how you define success, accolades, money, happiness, I'm the most successful I've ever. In my career, I'd be lying if I said I didn't want to go back to, you know, wrestling for a big f**kin arena or stadium or walking a Target or Wal-Mart, see my action figure, not one that I created, you know, major promoter XCOM, you know that like, of course, I'd have a phone call, but right now we're f**king killing it and we're working our asses off. We're f**king loving it. We're having fun. So it was take three CS for me to get me to go back somewhere. It's got to be very flattering for you. It is very flattering. It's my favorite. What I know. Same, same kind of thing that Matt said. I mean, like, it's yeah. For the first time in my life, you know, I would have to think about a big offer, whereas before getting, you know, getting a call from WWE my whole life and then, you know, my wrestling career. Yeah, sure. Whatever. You know, that's what I was before, because as an Australian, the first place, it's going to offer you a visa. You take it because you need to get out of Australia. If you want to be successful in wrestling, you got to get out. It's an island, you know. So the mentality then was, take the first thing that's given to you. Whereas now I'm in a position where I don't have to take the first thing that's offered to me anymore, and I can be a bit more selective. And, you know, I don't have the three CS requirements, but it's similar, you know, I mean, I'm not going to walk in and say that I need as much creative control as maybe he would, but he did 15 years there. I didn't. I don't need like high quality creative control. That's what I'm saying. I don't want to. I don't want to be just another guy in the roster. Been there, done that right? And then there are no promises ever. But at least like with the intent, you know? Yeah. And I don't think anybody's going to get creative. But you know what I mean, creative. Like like, we have an idea of there's a play. This is what we're going to do. I don't want to be another guy in the f**king around. Been there. Done that. Yeah, yeah. Did it. And one of them, like, I do want to work with Matt, you know, I mean, like, what we're doing now is the most fun I've ever had in my career. I'm making the most money I've ever made in wrestling. So like, wow, whatever has to whatever offer I'm getting has to be better than this. And this is pretty good right now. So I'm not in a rush to change anything either. If you if you could have an action figure made by any company right now. Yeah. A new one, right? Besides, big rubber guys are major vendors. Well, obviously because you have the I mean, I wish I had some big rubber guys here, although they're on pre-order. Well, they're coming in. Probably this time next week, you'll have one if you pre-ordered. I mean, if you get a pre-order demolition. Yeah. But I mean, I'm hoping I can get Brian and Matt in my hands first to do the old test. I promise you the best LJ and ASC figures ever made better more than other than the AL-JADAAN, obviously, but better than the Jacks. Try to do them chocolate, try to do them jazz was trying to do. We're number two behind LDN for sure. Yeah, yeah, I'm the original. Yes, that's right. Yes. What would that company be? Aside from any company that you already own? Well, if WWE, if I ever went back, the one thing I would require. This is legit. Now, legit, is that Mattel would have to f**k me and give the UN f**k me and give me my WrestleMania 35 elite figure at Bill McQueen. If you're listening. You would need to unlock me and make that figure. Yeah, that's not mine. I'm kidding. I don't know what they do, but I love you, Mattel. I've nothing to do with it, by the way. I love Mattel to f**king promote them for free every f**king week. Other major other pockets. I love Mattel, but I'm right in front of me. The retro. I'm kidding. But yeah, I would love. Listen, Jaswant Gillnet, Mattel is killing it, so I would love an elite figure or a supreme figure or whatever, you know, unripe whatever they're calling him, of course. Yeah, but that wouldn't go back to a company just to get an action figure. Can I not? At this point, it'd be. It'd be nice. Yeah, I mean, I can't get this, I guess. Um, sometimes I think about like, OK, you know, if if Cardona were coming back, if the three CS were where you were right and this unit, we're headed back to WWE. I can't get this thought out of my head and you tell me, okay, if if this is as appealing to you as it is your fantasy book and here fantasy. But you know, we need Vince Russo here, Brian. This is this is what I do. OK? Can you imagine? Imagine I'm wired, I'm going to hate it, and I need to hide my face like, Hey, can you imagine the reaction, right? Obviously, you're good at keeping secrets. Unlike what Cody Rhodes says right now, the pair could trigger either. And you're not a background checker. But can you imagine if nobody knew it was coming like, let's see, you worked in indie day the night before? Yeah. By the way, that's the way we would do it. Yes, you absolutely have, yeah. And Edge is on TV, and he either wins a big match or he cuts an emotional promo or something like that and just gets nailed with a bro ski boot. But you might lose wrong, lucky goose. Matt Cardona No reports, no Sean Ross Sapp, Sir Nick townsman smartening anybody up and just out of nowhere on a pay per view or on a smack down. Matt Cardona shows up. You're there with them, of course. And this and it's, you know, I mean, the Nice Little Mix tag there as well, isn't that Al Gore stars as a layup? Yeah, that's a laugh comes back. You held me down. I was your young boy. You didn't let me get the glory. I was entitled to say, never recovered. Do you understand I never recovered? They pushed me off the Titan trot in a wheelchair. I never write this address. Edge had. That was always a dream match of mine still is. And when he had to retire, I thought it would never happen. And now, you know, he's back. Then I get fired. But there are still, you know, there's still time. 200 percent. It's definitely up there for my dream match edge versus Matt Cardona, Edwards, Zack Ryder, Zacharias f**king dead dead. But you have all that footage. Yeah, you have that. That's real history right there. And Edge is a guy who I tell her all the time, like, I'm just opening the door for her. She has to f**king deliver it. She has been. But yeah, right. And that's the thing. Yeah. And I don't think anybody I would hope nobody misinterpret that. Like, this isn't just you. It's actually one hundred percent of the heat position you have. Really not. If you weren't on fire with this, it'd be like because that would hurt you. She wasn't working. And I say, you know, I open the door for you. Just like Edge opened it for me right now without edge, and now I'm going to shut it down where she's like at base and reboot. You're right. The hell, yeah. Yeah, yeah, I would. I would absolutely love that. That's that's a real bad bug in there. And then after the whole edge storyline, even if Edge ends up winning, doesn't matter. Yeah, the next day I'll put her up and put the kid over. I'll get, but they can't. Over the next night on Raw, you attack Cody Rhodes and you pick him up by his hair and you look at him in the face and you go, I am not a better check. That's right. And then I take that strong eyelid nightmare family jacket and I birdie birdie. I'm never where you're like Sgt. Slaughter Jacket is on a stick and you're burning dead right itself. Yeah, you're general, Adnan, right? You have mixed tag match there, too. He comes back, Oh, look at the it's a mixed bag city. And luckily Chelsea is on fire on her own over here. I'll put another another on that line. Right? Right, you see? Yeah. When she attacks the after the match for the mixed tag, then Chelsea comes from like walks backstage with the glittery star sweater. What about this? What about this? What about this, Chelsea? What you never understood is all these idiots have wives, but only I have a heater. Yeah, and you turn on your own wife. There we go. A little too far there. Yeah, no. Why do you want to disrupt the home? Oh, don't you don't want? No, no, no, no. You those, they should book. Yeah, they should put you on the booking team. You think so? Yeah, I just be sitting there pitching man card. All right, enough with PR. Yeah, that'd be great. I would love that. Yeah, you work in stay ever while you just sneak into the writers room. Just go up there. Yeah, yeah. Spud, what do you think about? Have you seen Vince in Stamford with the most? I have not seen it, cause I'm usually in the TV studio, not in the mustache. Looks great. It looks amazing. You thought about doing the mustache for a little bit. You did. Yeah, well, you did. Don't forget a CCW championship, done. You did the do rag. I said that to him. I would do the he popped up. What you told me. Nobody had reached out to you. Well, he did reach out to me. I reached out to him. But did he respond? He responded, Yeah, nice. But that was that wasn't about it. That was about coming back. No, she just texted him, Look, boss, I'm dressed as you and I have since tried to text them, but they went green. They my situation situations. No right, but I checked every day. It's blue again. It's a blue, which I got. But he liked it. He enjoyed the tribute. Well, yeah, he did. Do you understand? I mean, I guess that's that's probably next level. Yeah, if you started showing up to CW shows with Vince twenty twenty three mustache, oh my god, so much. There's so many guys in wrestling with mustache. I think people will get the joke. That's not a joke. I think he looks very good. I think he looks good. We need a Mattel with the new mustache. I wonder if they're allowed. I wonder if they can do it. They should. I want it. I want it. I want it. Yeah, I want it. Maybe Cody should bring the mustache back. Ooh, imagine that especially Santa wouldn't match his hair. He'd have blond hair and mustache. He dies. The mustache, that's he'll turn. Bad mustache and stashing is that he's still my phone is dashing Cody Rhodes, just like your corporate, said Robert. I mean, technically I was texting Zack Ryder today, so I don't change anything from the grave. Well, look, I got to let you go, man, you got to get to queens. That's right. You got to defend your world heavyweight championship at the time of this conversation against Carlito. A little Caribbean cool. Yeah, you heard he's back, though. Yeah. Well, sorry about your loser, right? Is there anything? I mean, I know you got a hundred things going on all at the same time. You know, the obviously the major wrestling figure podcast is on fire, the whole faith community. You guys let me in the Facebook group for free. I appreciate that. Are you in there? I'm in the face off for free. I'm so sorry. I'm watching what you said, Sean. He's upset with you. Oh, I don't post that much, but I look back and it's crazy, great community that is. I love. It's unbelievable. It's really like bringing people together and so many friendships that have been made through that people go in each other's weddings, people using the major fitness challenge, changing their their whole lives. And it's it's crazy. It's so much more than wrestling figures. It really is a community. It's like the DDP yoga of wrestling figures. I love it. I just spent two days in the DDP in Atlanta. I might be doing that too. Really? Oh, it's great. It's so much fun. The cold plunge is f**king cold. Oh yeah, it's colder than you think. Well, big Robert, guys. Obviously, you're going to major pod merch dot com. Yeah, get the big rubber guys. I don't know. Does anybody have access to the SDLP Bendis anymore? I got to get one now because you've been here. Those will be arriving soon, but they were pre-order, so I know I will be on eBay. You know, I might remind voters the measures for major pop merch. All right, I'll head up. Yeah, yeah. We'll see. Well, thanks for having us. Yeah, yeah. Thank you for coming. And yeah, we'll have to do it again. And it's amazing to watch the journey. You much.